Current Topics
Locked letters Encryption 1587
by pondering_it_all
1 second ago
RoundTable at the End of the Trump Regime!
by pondering_it_all
13 minutes 28 seconds ago
3 word story game
by Irked
Today at 06:53 AM
investigation into the storming of the United States Capitol on 1/6/21
by TatumAH
Yesterday at 10:29 PM
Mars
by TatumAH
Yesterday at 04:08 PM
Another reason for impeachment
by jgw
03/01/21 07:29 PM
White supremacist
by jgw
02/28/21 08:02 PM
Why some kids stick with their parents' political views and others rebel
by TatumAH
02/27/21 05:50 PM
Wizard of Oz
by TatumAH
02/23/21 03:49 AM
Global warming predictions
by jgw
02/22/21 07:43 PM
Slavery in 2020
by jgw
02/22/21 07:33 PM
Doctors fighting back against anti-vaxers online
by pondering_it_all
02/22/21 03:35 AM
Myanmar/Burma
by jgw
02/21/21 07:11 PM
It’s Not You, It’s Pathological Ambivalence!
by logtroll
02/21/21 03:51 AM
‘Earthworm Dilemma’ Has Climate Scientists Racing to Keep Up
by TatumAH
02/20/21 05:31 PM
And Then the Gorillas Started Coughing
by pondering_it_all
02/19/21 10:06 PM
Politics- sailing on the Sea of Insanity
by TatumAH
02/19/21 03:24 PM
An amusement - no politics!
by TatumAH
02/19/21 02:33 AM
American Healthcare
by pondering_it_all
02/16/21 03:41 AM
The Trump Era's silver lining
by pdx rick
02/15/21 04:41 PM
Forum Stats
6292 Members
61 Forums
17083 Topics
306810 Posts

Max Online: 294 @ 12/06/17 12:57 AM
Google Adsense
Page 20 of 29 < 1 2 ... 18 19 20 21 22 ... 28 29 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#112304 - 05/22/09 11:22 AM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: issodhos]
loganrbt Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 5850
Loc: Massaphuggintwoshirts
 Originally Posted By: issodhos


You do realize, do you not, NW Ponderer, that "e pluribus unum" simply means "out of many states, one nation" -- and later repositioned to mean "out of many immigrating peoples, a single people?" Why attempt to falsely color it as a call for a sociopolitical collective?


Well, actually, the meaning you attribute to the phrase was a filch of the real original meaning which was to describe a magazine publication that pulled together articles from multiple issues into a single issue; a kind of "Greatest Hits" issue.

Why attempt to falsely color it?
_________________________
"The white men were as thick and numerous and aimless as grasshoppers, moving always in a hurry but never seeming to get to whatever place it was they were going to." Dee Brown

Top
#112310 - 05/22/09 12:20 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: Greger]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 17485
Greger,
 Originally Posted By: Greger
Perhaps I oversimplify when I leave out commonwealth and immigrants and all the other semantics that can be tied to the phrase and suggest that "out of many, one" is what e pluribus unum means, simply a synonym for United. The phrase can be used to describe many things but I think it really has only one meaning.
And I like thinking of the United States as cheese - as it requires disparate ingredients, some messy decay to be worthwhile, and becomes more interesting with age.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

Top
#112311 - 05/22/09 12:24 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: ]
Schlack Offline
veteran

Registered: 07/22/04
Posts: 9739
Loc: Ireland
 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
And I like thinking of the United States as cheese


ermmmm.

so many possibilities i cant decide how to respond
_________________________
"The basic tool for the manipulation of reality is the manipulation of words. If you can control the meaning of words, you can control the people who must use the words."
(Philip K.Dick)


Top
#112312 - 05/22/09 12:26 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: ]
numan Offline
veteran

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 10853
Loc: What! Me Worry?
 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer

And I like thinking of the United States as cheese - as it requires disparate ingredients, some messy decay to be worthwhile, and becomes more interesting with age.



Until it becomes covered with mold and is inedible --- as is now the case. ;\)

-
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools -- Herbert Spencer

Top
#112313 - 05/22/09 12:34 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: pdx rick]
numan Offline
veteran

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 10853
Loc: What! Me Worry?
 Originally Posted By: issodhos

Your system has failed time and time again and the only response to its failure is to do the same thing over again.



 Originally Posted By: california rick

Isn't that the definition of insanity? To perform the task the same way over and over again and expect different results each time the task is repeated.



Well, isn't that the case with people who over and over expect the Constitution to work and produce a decent society? ;\)

-
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools -- Herbert Spencer

Top
#112324 - 05/22/09 01:44 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: numan]
loganrbt Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 5850
Loc: Massaphuggintwoshirts
 Originally Posted By: numan
 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer

And I like thinking of the United States as cheese - as it requires disparate ingredients, some messy decay to be worthwhile, and becomes more interesting with age.



Until it becomes covered with mold and is inedible --- as is now the case. ;\)

-


I take you've never enjoyed a fine Stilton or Roquefort?
_________________________
"The white men were as thick and numerous and aimless as grasshoppers, moving always in a hurry but never seeming to get to whatever place it was they were going to." Dee Brown

Top
#112328 - 05/22/09 01:53 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: loganrbt]
numan Offline
veteran

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 10853
Loc: What! Me Worry?
 Originally Posted By: loganrbt

I take you've never enjoyed a fine Stilton or Roquefort?



I knew someone was going to try pulling a line like that --- even though the phrase, "covered with mold and is inedible," cuts those cheeses out of the Venn diagram. ;\)

-
_________________________
The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools -- Herbert Spencer

Top
#112346 - 05/22/09 03:22 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: ]
issodhos Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 12581
 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
I suppose you haven't spent much time on the Constitution, have you - its structure and purpose? Oh, but discussion of that substantive portion of my earlier post would detract from the distraction of focusing on semantics, wouldn't it?

Well, I must admit that I have not spent much time restructuring, re-purposing, and fancifully re-interpreting it into a moldy piece of cheese that can be shaped into any transient form that is useful at any given moment, NW Ponderer.

 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
"Rights" are merely interests that have gained sufficient importance to be protected by legal strictures - oh, which means protected by the State.


That is, at best, a description of privileges granted (and easily rescinded) by the State to its subjects, NW Ponderer, not Rights. Though, I do see how handy it can be to present Rights as being subject to the arbitrary interpretation of a ruling class, I remain much more comfortable with what I wrote in another thread quite some time back:
 Originally Posted By: issodhos
Allow me to first repeat, with emphasis added, what I have previously written, which was, “My view is that rights are inalienable and pre-exist the state and also pre-exist any agreement made among men to recognize them.” Please note that I did not write that they pre-existed man. I also wrote that “rights are integral to the human mind” which is to say they are integral to man. They are essential to the completeness of man and reflect the nature of man, not nature in general, not ‘natural’ man, but the nature of man.

Yours,
Issodhos
_________________________
"When all has been said that can be said, and all has been done that can be done, there will be poetry";-) -- Issodhos

Top
#112347 - 05/22/09 03:26 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: issodhos]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 17485
In other words, rights are "notional."
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

Top
#112349 - 05/22/09 03:33 PM Re: Libertarianism Makes You Stupid [Re: ]
issodhos Offline
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 09/29/05
Posts: 12581
 Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
In other words, rights are "notional."


In other words, Rights are "inherent". How's that for a stand-off?:-)
Yours,
Issodhos
_________________________
"When all has been said that can be said, and all has been done that can be done, there will be poetry";-) -- Issodhos

Top
Page 20 of 29 < 1 2 ... 18 19 20 21 22 ... 28 29 >

Who's Online
1 registered (1 invisible), 56 Guests and 5 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Superfly, GreatNewsTonight, danarhea, RoughDraft274, CPWILL
6292 Registered Users
A2