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#112025 - 05/19/09 11:00 PM Pension plan failures increase
itstarted Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 6390
Loc: Florida/Illinois
A few weeks ago, I subscribed to the email alerts from the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation.
Without going back over the subject of Pensions that has been fairly well documented and discussed on these pages, I thought it remarkable to see the rapidly increasing number of Plans that have been taken over by the PBGC.
FYI and heads up, here are five notices that were announced in just the last 8 days.
Very little in the news, but if the rate of failed pensions continues at this rate, I'd expect more attention in the future.

Here are links to the notifications:


And a current summary from Bloomberg, that covers the potential from the Auto Industry
Bloomberg


Edited by itstarted (05/19/09 11:12 PM)
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#112295 - 05/22/09 09:25 AM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
Joe Keegan Offline
veteran

Registered: 12/25/05
Posts: 8707
You might find this article about the former head of the government's pension agency taking the Fifth interesting. Interesting, but not too surprising. From the article:
 Quote:
The former director of the government's pension agency invoked the Fifth Amendment on Wednesday when senators probed allegations that he had improper contacts with Wall Street firms while running the operation, which insures the pensions of one in seven Americans.

Charles E.F. Millard has previously denied that he was party to inappropriate phone calls and e-mails with firms that recently won multimillion-dollar contracts to advise the agency on a new strategy to invest its assets more heavily in stocks, real estate and private equity rather than more conservative securities. Six senior members of the Senate, however, have asked the Justice Department for an independent review.

During his brief appearance before the Senate Special Committee on Aging, Millard said repeatedly: "I have been advised by my counsel that I should invoke my constitutional rights and decline to answer any and all questions from the committee on this matter."

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#112919 - 05/26/09 11:53 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: Joe Keegan]
itstarted Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 6390
Loc: Florida/Illinois
Joe...
even worse than that, is that even after the whole derivative/CDO etc thing was happening, and it was obvious that those investments were going south... the plan was going whole hog after risky investments....
As with many other boards of directors, they either were too unsophisticated to know about investing, or worse, were complicit in fraud... An ugly scene.
..............................................
Since posting a few days ago, there have been two more new takeovers... Here's one:
New Pension Default
This one is a baddie, with less than 40% being funded.

Kinda strange that the media, and even people here on RR don't seem to notice that this... next to healthcare, may be the biggest problem to be faced in the next few years.

Here's another overview: 5/25 Article
 Quote:
WASHINGTON — The rapidly deteriorating financial health of the federal agency that guarantees 44 million Americans' pensions is raising alarms in Congress.

The Pension Benefit Guaranty Corp. deficit was $33.5 billion in the red at the end of March, triple its deficit six months earlier.

The recession threatens to add to the strain on the corporation by pushing more companies into bankruptcy and leaving the struggling agency responsible for their pensions.

..........................................
For example, the agency faces a potential tidal wave of claims from Chrysler and General Motors, whose pension plans are underfunded by an estimated $29 billion, the Government Accountability Office said.

If the PBGC’s condition continues to deteriorate, the government could come under pressure to shore it up with taxpayer funds, the GAO said in testimony to the Senate’s Special Committee on Aging.

“The Committee has grave concerns about the agency’s viability,” said Sen. Herb Kohl, D-Wis., the committee’s chairman.
more...



Edited by itstarted (05/27/09 12:06 AM)
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#114102 - 06/06/09 05:16 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
itstarted Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 6390
Loc: Florida/Illinois
Here's a new approach by NY State, to alleviate the pension debt mountain.
New Approach to Pensions
Gotta think about this one.


Edited by itstarted (06/06/09 05:17 PM)
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#119915 - 07/16/09 11:33 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
itstarted Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 6390
Loc: Florida/Illinois
Here's an update on the state of Pension Plans, with a few notes about the threat to boomers (who have pension plans or not).

Posted to keep the thread alive, with an eye to the uproar that will eventually occur.
Touble on the horizon - Pension Plans
.................................................

Remember the coming "big" problems...
Mortgage resets
Commercial real estate
Pensions
Endowments
Municipal bond failures
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#119930 - 07/17/09 07:28 AM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
Joe Keegan Offline
veteran

Registered: 12/25/05
Posts: 8707
I suspect that we'll see an uproar if the states should issue I.O.U.'s to their pensioners instead of dollars.

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#120452 - 07/22/09 12:46 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
itstarted Offline
old hand

Registered: 01/27/03
Posts: 6390
Loc: Florida/Illinois
If you stumble on this, take a moment to think about the implications for the future.

Delphi was the auto parts manufacturer closely associated with GM. As just a side note to the bankruptcy, GM, departed ways. Delphi had 8 Billion dollars of Pension Obligations. Only half of that was funded. the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation just picked up the full obligation.

You didn't hear a word about this.
PBGC release.

After all, four thousand million isn't enough to raise an eyelid.
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#120459 - 07/22/09 02:09 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: itstarted]
AustinRanter Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/29/06
Posts: 3643
Loc: Austin, Texas
 Originally Posted By: itstarted
If you stumble on this, take a moment to think about the implications for the future.

Delphi was the auto parts manufacturer closely associated with GM. As just a side note to the bankruptcy, GM, departed ways. Delphi had 8 Billion dollars of Pension Obligations. Only half of that was funded. the Pension Benefit Guaranty Corporation just picked up the full obligation.

You didn't hear a word about this.
PBGC release.

After all, four thousand million isn't enough to raise an eyelid.


Bob...where's the love and compassionate government for all of those affected by the follow:

 Originally Posted By: PBGC Site
Since Delphi entered bankruptcy protection in 2005, the PBGC has worked with Delphi, GM and other stakeholders to keep all the pension plans ongoing or to have them assumed by GM. In 2008, GM did assume responsibility for a portion of the Delphi hourly pension plan, and was expected to take back the entire hourly plan. However, GM itself reorganized in bankruptcy earlier this year and now states it is unable to afford the additional financial burden of the Delphi pensions.

~~~SNIP~~~

The PBGC can pay benefits only up to the limits set by law. Those limits are more likely to affect early retirees and those who receive supplemental benefits. Some individuals will see reduced benefits. The PBGC cannot estimate individual benefit amounts until several months after becoming trustee of the plan.


However, the goverment will jump out its ass to give mega billions to the likes of Goldman Sachs, who is a primary owner of the Federal Reserves...who will use bailout money from the goverment to exploit all that they can by lend to (our money loaned back to us) at considerable interest rates.

Thanks for your posting...
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#120479 - 07/22/09 04:17 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: AustinRanter]
numan Offline
veteran

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 10853
Loc: What! Me Worry?
'

Well, if these pension plans are riddled with corruption and incompetence (it's a boring refrain these days, isn't it?) then the government should be responsible for all American pensions --- period.

That is the way pensions --- and health insurance --- are handled in all the civilized countries of the world.

And don't fall for the bull crap that we can't afford such programs --- Britain and France established national health insurance amid the wreckage of the Second World War! Unless the USA is a lot poorer than even I think, we can afford properly structured programs.

But, then, that would mean that Americans would need to learn from foreigners --- utterly unthinkable!

.
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#120493 - 07/22/09 05:49 PM Re: Pension plan failures increase [Re: numan]
Allen Owen Offline
stranger

Registered: 11/24/05
Posts: 165
I've often thought that there is a lot to learn from other countries. For example, I think Germany has the best public transportation system in the world. You haven't traveled until you've ridden on a train in Germany. By comparison, the US rail system is pitiful, even though it wasn't always that way. What works elsewhere may not work here, but I don't see why we can't take what has been successful elsewhere and adapt it to our situation.

The big problem is our congress is rather bought and paid for by so many special interests that things like revitalizing our rail system will most likely not happen.


Edited by Allen Owen (07/22/09 05:50 PM)
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