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RETIREMENT
by Scoutgal
10/25/14 08:46 PM
Round Table For Week Of October 19th-October 25th, 2014
by Scoutgal
10/25/14 08:23 PM
F/A/O Phil: Help !!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!111
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by logtroll
10/25/14 06:02 PM
Muslim Woman Attacks Muslims For Demanding Halal Food At Minnesota Food Banks
by NW Ponderer
10/25/14 12:03 PM
"Same reason YOU get to live, breathe, and walk black!"
by california rick
10/25/14 11:37 AM
Brand new '2001: A Space Odyssey' trailer is gorgeous
by Golem
10/24/14 09:46 PM
Ebola
by logtroll
10/24/14 03:06 PM
Miscellaneous humor thread
by Golem
10/24/14 02:31 PM
Man Calls a Suicide Prevention Hotline, SWAT Team Shows Up and Kills Him
by logtroll
10/24/14 07:28 AM
The Savage Breast: A Music Clip Thread
by Golem
10/23/14 03:26 PM
Greta is pushing the 'Obama hates Fox News meme' in Tahmooresi case...
by Scoutgal
10/23/14 03:14 PM
Hong Kong chief: "Democracy would see poorer people dominate Hong Kong vote"
by california rick
10/22/14 04:42 PM
What does the collapse of gay marriage opposition portend?
by Scoutgal
10/21/14 09:24 PM
Law Enforcement Against Prohibition’s 10 Reasons to ... War on Drugs
by Scoutgal
10/21/14 09:23 PM
Clyburn challenger: Gay couples are 'gremlins' (Anthony Culler)
by Scoutgal
10/21/14 09:22 PM
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#226056 - 06/18/12 08:20 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: issodhos]
Greger Offline
veteran

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 11848
Loc: Florida


"Mister we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again"
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"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

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#226059 - 06/18/12 08:28 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: Greger]
logtroll Offline
old hand

Registered: 04/25/10
Posts: 6359
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Originally Posted By: Greger


"Mister we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again"

I believe that was "Hoybert Hoover", sir. nono
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#226108 - 06/19/12 01:58 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one o [Re: Phil Hoskins]
numan Offline
veteran

Registered: 08/06/08
Posts: 10853
Loc: What! Me Worry?
'
Originally Posted By: Phil Hoskins
But if there was not a fundamental agreement that things can be "owned" and controlled then you would not have all that wealth and complain about sharing it with others. Property is an agreement, not a "truth".

I cannot conceive of any politician telling the truth about this and proposing a real solution that calls on all Americans to share themselves and their property in a way that makes it possible for all to live a good life.

We have the means, we have the wealth, we are just selfish.

Very good, Phil, right on !!

I just disagree at the very end. Not everybody is selfish. I know many people who are not selfish -- at least to the extent of making changes in their lives for the good of society.
In fact, I'm one of them !!

It seems to me that the really selfish people are mainly in the One-Percent.
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The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools -- Herbert Spencer

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#226140 - 06/19/12 09:04 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one o [Re: Scoutgal]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
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Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 11939
And the 98% who aspire to be there, sadly.
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A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#226142 - 06/19/12 09:29 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one o [Re: NW Ponderer]
Greger Offline
veteran

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 11848
Loc: Florida

Quote:
It seems to me that the really selfish people are mainly in the One-Percent.


Quote:
And the 98% who aspire to be there


**whips out calculator and does the math**

Egad! That means I/We are members of the other 1%
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

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#226146 - 06/20/12 12:33 AM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: pondering_it_all]
california rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 36243
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
How about a "supporting cast" that has done everything possible to trip the star, block his moves on the stage, skip over or ad lib lines to subvert the script, and so forth! (And keeping with the theater metaphor, the debt-limit extortion = pulling the fire alarm during a performance!)

The Republicans said right at the beginning of Obama's term that they would do everything possible to prevent his reelection. Few of us realized that by "everything" they included even actions that would harm the economy (and all of us) in the set of "political acts". (As opposed to the set of criminal acts.)

You, are very correct, P-I-A.

Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
If Obama loses, then they succeeded.

'tis true as well. It's a conundrum for me. But, for the fiscal policies of the Obama Administration, the friendly overtures to banksters, the non-prosecution of banksters, the lack of real help for the middle-class - I can not support Mr. Obama. I certainly don't want Romney, but I just can't support Mr. Obama for re-election.

...and, don't even get me started on Mr. Obama's military forays.

IMHO, Mr. Obama needs to be punished for his policies. Of course, there is only one way to 'punish' a politician - at the polls.

I feel the same about Diane Feinstein. I didn't vote for her for the CA primary. I'm sick-and-tired of the people I vote for not follow through on the political philosophy which placed them into office.

Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
Maybe Democrats will rise to the occasion and put the needs of their country above their party. Maybe not.

How would Democrats do that? What does 'raising to the occasion' entail?
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#226160 - 06/20/12 12:26 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: california rick]
Greger Offline
veteran

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 11848
Loc: Florida
Quote:
It's a conundrum for me.

It shouldn't be. Unlike yourelf, I don't expect a president to follow through with all of the things I wanted him to do when I voted for him. Reality and the current political climate make this ipossible. But while he hasn't exactly hit the ball out of the park, he has prevented a few things from happening that I genuinely would hate to see happen, while accomplishing a few things I am quite pleased with.
If not Geitner...then who? Regarding his stance on national security, what experience do you have that would better qualify you to make those decisions? Idealism is a wonderful thing. But this isn't an ideal world and reality often intrudes.
You have chosen not to endorse a candidate who has come out of the closet on same sex marriage, who has paved the way for a national healthcare system, who has ended one war, and will soon begin a draw down in Afghanistan. It's simply not enough you say.
Groovy.
Willard Romney is waiting in the wings and praying you don't vote for Obama.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

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#226162 - 06/20/12 12:41 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: Greger]
california rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 36243
Loc: Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted By: Greger
...If not Geitner...then who?

The choices in November 2008 were: Paul Volker and Tim Geitner. Mr. Obama chose Tim Geitner.

Originally Posted By: Greger
...who has paved the way for a national healthcare system...

By acquiescing to the insurance industry and taking the government option off of the table, as Mr. Obama stated on The View recently: In my second term, I'll have to pass health care reform - again.

Had he not caved to the insurance industry the first time, we'd have national health care - and not before the SCOTUS as well.

Originally Posted By: Greger
Willard Romney is waiting in the wings and praying you don't vote for Obama.

Romney still hasn't convinced all of the GOP voters. It's pretty much a draw between the conservative GOP'ers and the progressives sitting this one out.
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#226168 - 06/20/12 01:58 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: california rick]
Phil Hoskins Offline
Administrator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 20642
Loc: West Hollywood, CA
Quote:
Had he not caved to the insurance industry the first time, we'd have national health care - and not before the SCOTUS as well.

More likely there would be no health bill at all.
_________________________
Life is a banquet -- and most poor suckers are starving to death -- Auntie Mame
You are born naked and everything else is drag - RuPaul

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#226169 - 06/20/12 02:12 PM Re: Who do we like for President? Not a damn one of th [Re: california rick]
Greger Offline
veteran

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 11848
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Fate of 2012 Election Falling Into the Hands of the Tuned-Out Youth Vote


Hey, 20-somethings, occupiers and unemployed college graduates—did you know that the fate of the 2012 presidential election rests in your hands?

That’s right, even though you have correctly concluded that the political and economic system is corrupt to the core and backsliding on many issues that matter to you—from getting a solid start in your professional life, to having some privacy and being free of government intrusion, to healthcare, to holding greedy institutions accountable—the emerging political landscape is giving you tremendous power: but only if you vote.

According to John Zogby, a pollster with decades of experience tracking voting trends, the coalition that helped elect Barack Obama in 2008 is slowly coming together this year with one exception: young voters between the ages of 18 and 29. The rest -- African Americans, Latinos, women, and professionals who abhor the GOP’s regressive reproductive health policies -- are slowly lining up behind Obama.
>snip<
"This is the first week that I am imagining that he could actually lose,” Zogby said late last week. “The fly in the ointment for Obama and Democrats are young voters.

Link
Voters your age Rick, should act their age and vote responsibly. Or face exactly what you DON'T want to happen.

If President Obama endorses even a hypothetical de-criminalization of Marijuana he's got the youth vote and the election in the bag.
But he's got kids...he doesn't want them turning into potheads like Meghan McCain so he may sacrifice the White House over that issue.
But that's just my opinion. You vote or don't vote any way you please.
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