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#299312 - 03/07/17 04:53 AM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Greger]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 377
Loc: Upstate NY
My heating circulating unit fits on the end of an elongated clear plastic container. It mates with both corners on the end, but that can be modified to fit a corner of any rectangular enclosure. The circulation is strong enough to see herb pulsation in the bag, but also tended to suck the bags rolleyes into the intake orifice. I ended up clipping the bags to the container with those big double handle paper clips.

Everything take 10x time on the first effort. I kept an eye on it all day, and now am confident to leave it un-watched, even overnight. I took off the insulation, to be able to watch it better, and with just a slab of styrofoam covering it, it needed no water addition over 8 hrs. The unit pretty much seals its end, and the syro covered the rest. Its going to be a piece of cake!

BTW do you bake, other than living in the steamy south which is more a braise than bake. I have been hankering to get into sourdough, but on thing at a time. I saw the bread special on PBS, and was hooked, on the idea. If you try to live on flour you die, but if you let the yeastie boys loose on it you get protein and other goodies from their tiny bodies. Though the Christian would disagree, you can live on bread alone!

Tat
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Except that it's lonesome work
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#299320 - 03/07/17 02:48 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: TatumAH]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 13752
Loc: Florida
I don't bake as much as I used to but yes. More often than not I use a bread machine to mix and knead the dough then take it out and bake it in the oven. I'm also fond of the simple no-knead recipes where you mix the flour, salt, water, and a tiny amount of yeast and let it sit overnight to ferment. I was unimpressed with sourdough. Too much work, too much waste. All that feeding and discarding became a nuisance. But I got some interesting bread out of it. Some of the fluffiest loaves I've ever baked. As a science experiment you might find it fun and rewarding, as an avocation, like me, you'll probably tire of it and go back to simpler methods. But by all means give it a shot...uh...if you already know how to bake bread. If you aren't a baker yet learn the basics first before jumping into the world of sourdough.

What brand sous vide pod are you using? I kind of assumed Anova, I use the Gourmia brand. Your description has confused me a little.
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"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken." Oscar Wilde

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#299321 - 03/07/17 02:51 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Greger]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 13752
Loc: Florida
It just dawned on me...you're a science guy....you brought home a Poly Science unit from the lab didn't you! You dog!
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#299322 - 03/07/17 03:06 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Greger]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1551
Loc: Middle, USA
OK, you made me look it up. I live in that vast wasteland between the two coasts and it takes a while for new things to get here.

So, you seal food in a plastic bag and give it a water bath ... basically? Do they have non BPA (and non other toxic chemicals) bags? That part worries me a bit. Wonder if you could use a canning jar.
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Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#299328 - 03/07/17 05:20 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Spag-hetti]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 377
Loc: Upstate NY
Originally Posted By: Spag-hetti
OK, you made me look it up. I live in that vast wasteland between the two coasts and it takes a while for new things to get here.

So, you seal food in a plastic bag and give it a water bath ... basically? Do they have non BPA (and non other toxic chemicals) bags? That part worries me a bit. Wonder if you could use a canning jar.


Yes, that is exactly what it "boils" down to. There are other slow cooking methods crocpots and braising, but for me the major advantage is demonstrated in the following graph.

Those concerned with poultry food safety spend much of their time poking chicken chunks with quick response thermometers to make sure that internal temperature reaches the magic 165F.
To reach that internal temp the outer portions are frequently overcooked, think skinless un-marinated chicken breasts on the BBQ grill. Thick steaks have the similar problem, if you want the center rare but the rest edible.

Sous vide allows you to reach a safe temp without over cooking the rest. Bacteria of interest are certainly killed quickly at 165, but are just as dead at lower temps in the table, just for longer time periods.

The bags are food grade and polyethylene, and do not need mold release chemicals or plastizers like pthalates. I have a roll of mylar with polyethyene sheet that you can just fold so poly sides are together, and then seal with an iron or heat sealer.

Hadnt considered canning jars, but sure they would work but they should be topped up. If only partially filled leaving air, it would be equivalent to a mini crocpot. Low temp canning procedures are approved for some things like pickles that are high acid, but not meat.

Convenience is also a big factor particularly in restaurants, (or guest diners) as steaks and chicken can be sterilized by sous vide and stored closed if not opened, breaking sterility, and seared quickly when needed for serving.

I am sure Greger will have his comments and advice to add.

Tat




Edited by TatumAH (03/07/17 05:26 PM)
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There's nothing wrong with thinking
Except that it's lonesome work
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#299333 - 03/07/17 07:15 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: TatumAH]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 13752
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Do they have non BPA (and non other toxic chemicals) bags?

Yes. Regular ziplock bags work perfectly and are BPA free. The rolls of bag material sold for vacuum sealing units are also BPA free. The polycarbonate food storage container I cook in is not BPA free but the water never comes into contact with the food.

Tat's graph didn't load but I've seen it and it explains that longer times at lower temps kill pathogens just as well as that 165 degree number we were all familiar with. 165 is an instant kill number but with ordinary cooking methods the outside of the food must be grossly over cooked for before the internal temp ever reaches 165.
Hence the dried out chicken breasts we are all accustomed to. The sous vide method gently brings all the meat to the desired temperature and holds it there for a specified period of time. Since the temperature is precisely regulated even if you leave it in the water bath for much longer than the prescribed time it still doesn't overcook. An engineer from the Polyscience corporation, which makes the machines for laboratories to grow icky things under precisely controlled conditions, took the idea to food scientists and chefs to see if it was possible to cook food this way. It has been a smashing success and restaurants everywhere are using it now. It didn't take it long to move into the home cooking sphere.

This is not some sort of food fad any more than the microwave was.
But microwaves are AWFUL. Hot spots, cold spots, uneven temps and questionable times depending on the power of the microwave. A frozen, raw chicken breast will get half overcooked while the other half is still frozen. Nowadays I precook all the chicken breasts I buy the day I buy them, then freeze them in the bag they were cooked in. You can do the same with steaks, burgers, or any other meat. When it's time to cook dinner I fill the sous vide tank with hot water, and set it to heating. It only takes a few minutes to reach 140 degrees. Drop whatever frozen precooked meat you choose and drop it in the tank. In ten minutes you're good to go.
You can store any leftover vegetables, soups, stews, etouffes, or anything else in a ziplock or vacuum sealed container bag and bring it up to serving temp in minutes.

Canning jars? Yes! There are a lot of recipes for cooking things sous vide in jars. Starbucks has recently added Sous Vide Egg Bites to their menu. Easy breezy to do at home in 4 ounce jars. I don't care much for them though. Too dense. I like my eggs fried or scrambled English style. Custard desserts are also done in canning jars. Flans or Pots de Creme are easy and delicious.
But for the most part...bags work best.

The big deal about sous vide cooking is that you get perfectly cooked food every time with very little effort. You can get set up to do it for about $125 including the immersion pod, the polycarbonate container and the lid for it which you cut out with a pair of scissors for the pod to fit in.

I probably repeated some of what Tat said but I just sort of set my fingers typing and whatever comes out is nearly beyond my control.
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#299380 - 03/08/17 08:38 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Greger]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1551
Loc: Middle, USA
Thanks, guys. This is really interesting and I could be the first on my block ...
_________________________
Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#299381 - 03/08/17 09:43 PM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: Spag-hetti]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 377
Loc: Upstate NY
Originally Posted By: Spag-hetti
Thanks, guys. This is really interesting and I could be the first on my block ...


Hi Spag,

I feel it is my solemn responsibility to warn you about the obsessive disorder that can arise from the experience related to the total immersion baptism of sous vide! It is similar to other well recognized repetitive disorders that you may recognize, for example weedeater and powerwasher madness. Suddenly everything needs either the attention of the weedeater, or a good powerwashing. Takes the fleas right off the cats, though they tend to vanish for a while.

Any way, I blame all this on Greger, who fanned the flames of my smouldering interest into a full blown sous vide madness. The final stages of this have produced a new and very crippling condition the sous vide earworm that is devilishly purrsistent. I caught it from Greger and I hesitate to pass it on, but maybe it wont be as chronic in someone who wasnt around during its hayday, circa 1967-8.
OOOPS! No not the pork butt video (now bathing in the sous vide bath)


This one! My frenzied mind transposed sous vide into Sweet Pea, and so it remains going round and round and round. Very Catchy isnt it. Try not to think about it, you have been warned. Here are the lyrics to help you forget it!

Oh Sue Vide
Wontcha let me be
Wontcha, wontcha, wontcha,
Let me be-e-e-e

Tat

TOMMY ROE
"Sweet Pea"

Oh, Sweet Pea
Come on and dance with me
Come on, come on, come on and dance with me
Oh, Sweet Pea
Won't you be my girl
Won't you, won't you, won't you be my girl

I went to a dance just the other night
I saw a girl there she was out of sight
I asked a friend of mine who she could be
He said that her friends just call her Sweet Pea

Oh, Sweet Pea
Come on and dance with me
Come on, come on, come on and dance with me
Oh, Sweet Pea
Won't you be my girl
Won't you, won't you, won't you be my girl

I walked on over and I asked her to dance
Thinkin' maybe later on
We'd be makin' romance
But every guy there was thinkin'like me
I had to stand in line
To get a dance with Sweet Pea

Oh, Sweet Pea
Come on and dance with me
Come on, come on, come on and dance with me
Oh, Sweet Pea
Won't you be my girl
Won't you, won't you, won't you be my girl

I finally got to whisper sweet words in her ear
Convinced her that we oughta get away from there
We took a little walk
I held her close to me
And underneath the stars I said to Sweet Pea

Oh, Sweet Pea I love you can't you see
Love you, love you, love you can't you see
Oh, Sweet Pea
Won't you be my girl
Won't you, won't you, won't you be my girl
_________________________
There's nothing wrong with thinking
Except that it's lonesome work
sevil regit

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#299388 - 03/09/17 01:17 AM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: TatumAH]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 377
Loc: Upstate NY
I find this site one of the most helpful as it shows and describes the various meats with various times and temps. Oh Sue Vee

For example here are details for handling your pork.
I had a pork butt dissected as above and them 1" portions were sliced and considered as pork steaks or chops. The 60C sounded a bit rare to me and the 65 a little too done. I split the difference at 63C. and after 3.5 hours the pork was white through and through, and very tender and juicy, with just a bit of bite. I like my meat to resist a little with a predesignated safe word, uhh I mean safe temp! The gristle was gelatinous, but the pork was not yet pull-able. On sampling I thought it under-seasoned, due to hasty marinade, so I added 4 sprigs of fresh Rosemary, and absolutely no Jack of Hearts, [video:youtube]https://vimeo.com/81862481[/video] and a couple of tbsb of olive oil and resealed the bag and resumed the sous vide. Stay tuned.

Loose associations? No just right thanks!
Tat
_________________________
There's nothing wrong with thinking
Except that it's lonesome work
sevil regit

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#299391 - 03/09/17 03:50 AM Re: Sous vide cooking... [Re: TatumAH]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 13752
Loc: Florida
And I thought I was an obsessive cook...Tat's gone right off the deep end of the water bath.

I saw in the OH Sue Vee Porkchop link a recipe for Canadian bacon. I buy it from time to time and I really want to like it. But it's tough and dry and regular ham seems a bit more better with my eggs in the morning. But apparently if you cook it overnight(in the package it came in) at 145 degrees it transforms into something tender and delicious.

Gonna hafta give this one a try.
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