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#299679 - 03/17/17 07:47 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Ma_Republican]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6426
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
Why should working Americans have to pay outrageous amounts of money each month for coverage that most do not use? They have to do it because Obama embraced his socialist soul and decided that we really are responsible for our neighbors.


It has NOT A THING to do with Obama's "socialism" (which does not exist) and everything to do with how insurance works. You pay your premiums and they help pay your medical bills. Some of the pool are sick now, some are not. Those who are not sick now, will very likely be sick in the future.

The "outrageous amounts of money" you pay is actually less than you would be paying without ACA because hospitals charge their insured patients to cover the cost of the uninsured. The more uninsured, the more you pay.

And it is all based on the fantasy of "self insurance", that is paying your own family's medical bills as you consume medical services. Only problem is that hospitals charge cash customers up to 10 times what they charge insured customers for the very same thing. Even if you have a very high deductible policy that you never collect anything from, you still get the negotiated prices. That can save you thousands of dollars per year.

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#299713 - 03/18/17 01:12 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Jim D (FreeThinker)]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 15014
I say $695 is a paltry sum to pay for the freedom to be uninsured. Go for it, Ma! Be free!
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#299721 - 03/18/17 05:24 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Jim D (FreeThinker)]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6426
Loc: North San Diego County
Unfortunately, even when you think you have paid your $695 to be free, those darned paramedics will take you to the ER after your heart attack. While you are unconscious, the doctors will do an angioplasty and install a stent so you live another 20 years. Then you get the $200,000 bill and lose your house.

Ha, ha! You're screwed!

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#299722 - 03/18/17 05:28 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Jim D (FreeThinker)]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6426
Loc: North San Diego County
I just realized I must be some crazy hippy, arguing in favor of something as insane as "health insurance". Jeez, what next? Social Security?

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#299723 - 03/18/17 06:01 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: pondering_it_all]
Phil Hoskins Offline
Administrator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 21114
Loc: West Hollywood, CA
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
I just realized I must be some crazy hippy, arguing in favor of something as insane as "health insurance". Jeez, what next? Social Security?
Me too


Edited by Phil Hoskins (03/18/17 06:07 PM)
_________________________
Life is a banquet -- and most poor suckers are starving to death -- Auntie Mame
You are born naked and everything else is drag - RuPaul

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#299724 - 03/18/17 06:35 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Phil Hoskins]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 12413
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Phil Hoskins
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
I just realized I must be some crazy hippy, arguing in favor of something as insane as "health insurance". Jeez, what next? Social Security?
Me too


Me three.
Uhhhh PIA, "hippy" is a term used by Sergeant Joe Friday, or it refers to women with a lot of extra junk in the trunk.
Were you talking about a "hippie"?

_________________________
"Liberty is so important to "libertarians" that they think actually getting to exercise liberty should be a privilege that is overwhelmingly rationed in favor of the rich.
Recognizing this ought to tell us what we are dealing with."
---Piers Stephens

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#299725 - 03/18/17 06:44 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Ma_Republican]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 12413
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Ma_Republican
Poor people end up with health care either way, but as long as they don't have insurance it is better even if we all end up paying more. Why should working Americans have to pay outrageous amounts of money each month for coverage that most do not use?


Ma, I refer you to Bill Cassidy, a Republican senator from Lousiana:

Three ObamaCare replace myths

Quote:
"Everyone reading this knows someone or was personally diagnosed with diabetes. A doctor can treat diabetes so that the impact to health is marginal. But someone making $16,000 a year who, does not qualify for Medicaid, cannot afford the employee’s share of employer provided insurance and cannot pay cash for doctor visits or their medicines is not treated. Their blood sugar is always too high and they regularly go to the ER when their blood sugar becomes drastically uncontrolled. Each hospitalization costs society tens of thousands of dollars."
_________________________
"Liberty is so important to "libertarians" that they think actually getting to exercise liberty should be a privilege that is overwhelmingly rationed in favor of the rich.
Recognizing this ought to tell us what we are dealing with."
---Piers Stephens

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#299732 - 03/18/17 08:33 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: Jim D (FreeThinker)]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6426
Loc: North San Diego County
Poor people walking around with untreated TB is an even better example. Treat them for a few hundred a year or treat the dozens of people they pass it on to. Maybe they even give it to YOU or a family member. All it takes is walking down the street near them when they cough.

There is a whole bunch of contagious diseases we should vaccinate everybody we can as a public health effort. Likewise, there are a whole bunch of preventive things we should do on everybody (like breast cancer screening and colon cancer checks) because when you wait until they are advanced, treatment can be very costly and less successful.

Purely from an economic viewpoint, if you are not going to let people die untreated you might as well go with the care delivery system that is cheapest. Republican health care plans all ignore this simple bottom line for ideological reasons. Republican Health Care is too expensive!

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#299735 - 03/18/17 08:54 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: pondering_it_all]
Phil Hoskins Offline
Administrator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 06/07/04
Posts: 21114
Loc: West Hollywood, CA
Anyone too stingy to share the load of the cost of insurance is shortsighted, and deserves to contract an illness they cannot afford to treat.

But then the GOP plan is to bankrupt the nation so we are all too poor to treat disease. It is a plan to reduce the population drastically and painfully.
_________________________
Life is a banquet -- and most poor suckers are starving to death -- Auntie Mame
You are born naked and everything else is drag - RuPaul

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#299738 - 03/18/17 09:13 PM Re: GOP at war with itself on health care [Re: NW Ponderer]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 39988
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
I say $695 is a paltry sum to pay for the freedom to be uninsured. Go for it, Ma! Be free!

Ironic that Trumpcare places a penalty for not buying insurance. laugh
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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