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#300370 - 04/04/17 04:41 AM Re: Brexit Eve [Re: Schlack]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6762
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
Brits want May to get a Brexit deal that the EU has already shot down several times


Good luck with that: Basically, you voted to screw yourselves. Now shut up and bend over.

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#300822 - 04/21/17 03:45 PM Re: Brexit Eve [Re: Schlack]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 378
Loc: Upstate NY
I remain confused, that is getting to be my default condition! Isnt May's call for a new election, just a do-over referendum on Brexit, obscured by, political machinations?

I clearly do not have an understanding of British political nuance.

Tat

brexit do-over??

Quote:
Prime Minister Theresa May, who was actually against Brexit before she was for it, made another dramatic U-turn on Tuesday, declaring that Britain needs to elect a new Parliament in June, three years ahead of schedule, despite her clear promise not to call an election when she campaigned to succeed David Cameron last year.


Quote:
In her address to the nation, May claimed that a fresh election was necessary to keep opposition parties from obstructing her Conservative government during negotiations over Britain’s withdrawal from the European Union.

That argument rang hollow, however, given that the opposition Labour Party had just voted for the government’s bill to begin the process of leaving the E.U. and is not campaigning to overturn the results of last year’s referendum.

What Brexit opponents? If there were Brexit opponents we'd vote for them pic.twitter.com/nKDDSn7eWl

— Graham Linehan (@Glinner) April 18, 2017

Separatist leader vows to crack down on opposition "endangering security of millions" as vote could boost regime with sweeping new powers

— Philip Oltermann (@philipoltermann) April 18, 2017

To most political observers, it was clear that May’s decision was driven by something else: a desire to capitalize on the unprecedented weakness of the Labour Party, which is divided over Brexit, and its own leader, Jeremy Corbyn, and has trailed the Conservatives by up to 21 points in recent polls.

With the PM calling a general election for 8 June, here's YouGov's most recent voting intention
Con – 44%
Lab – 23%
LD – 12%
UKIP – 10% pic.twitter.com/t6v36qPSrn


Quote:
— David Schneider (@davidschneider) April 18, 2017

Paul Mason, a journalist and filmmaker, suggested that Labour should accept that under Britain’s current electoral system, it can no longer win power alone and should form “a progressive alliance” with other center-left parties, including the Greens, Scottish and Welsh nationalists and, perhaps, Liberal Democrats.

Yes please, Theresa May: call an election now so majority who do not want hard Brexit can stop it. Labour: Progressive Alliance now!


Quote:
“The Conservatives are likely to lose most of the 27 seats they took off the Lib Dems in the last election,” Dunt explained, as a result of anger over Brexit from the 48 percent of the country that voted against it. “These are uniquely chaotic and volatile political times,” he added. “If a progressive alliance against hard Brexit could be formed, it would hit the Conservatives. It might not defeat them — but the prime minister needs to massively increase her majority in order to justify this decision.”

In other words, the fact that the U.K.’s major parties were both sharply divided over Brexit makes it hard to predict exactly how an election dominated by the issue will turn out.

“The fact that the leadership of both main parties has disintegrated would under normal circumstances be a big story, but in the current chaos it is no more than a side effect,” John Lanchester wrote in the London Review of Books last year, just after David Cameron resigned.

The deeper problem is that the referendum has exposed splits in society which aren’t mapped by the political parties as they are currently constituted. People talk about Britain being ‘divided’ as if that’s a new issue, but societies are often divided, and the interests of all groups and individuals do not align. If they did, humanity would be the Borg. Political parties are the mechanism through which divisions in society are argued over and competing interests asserted.

The trouble with where we are now is that the configuration of the parties doesn’t match the issues which need to be resolved. To simplify, the Tories are a coalition of nationalists, who voted out, and business interests, who voted in; Labour is a coalition of urban liberals, who voted in, and the working class, who voted out. This means that if a general election were held tomorrow on the single issue of the referendum, the voter wouldn’t know whom to vote for. It wouldn’t be at all clear which faction in either party was likely to prevail when the hugely important details of what Brexit means come to be debated.
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Except that it's lonesome work
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#300832 - 04/21/17 08:25 PM Re: Brexit Eve [Re: Schlack]
pondering_it_all Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 6762
Loc: North San Diego County
I think it's really pretty simple: Everyone who believes "Wogs begin at Calais" voted to exit, solely to get rid of foreigners. They can't really grasp all those details about economics, etc. It's just driven by xenophobia.

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