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#302330 - 07/15/17 02:51 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pdx rick]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16060
I think the whole Russia debacle can be explained in two thoughts: Trump is remarkably dumb and manipulable - he's instinctually corrupt, and so is his family; and Russian agents look for gullible folks like them to manipulate. Everything about this affair screams "KGB". It also serves Putin's interests that the Trumps get bogged down in scandal, because it keeps the US from being engaged in world affairs. How much better that Trump already agreed with him.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#302332 - 07/15/17 03:24 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: NW Ponderer]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8809
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Speaking of manipulability, how deep does the putrescence run? It's not just the Russians who are using Trump for a stooge.

Hi-jacked democracy

Quote:
He called the company a central point in the right’s “propaganda machine”, a line I quoted in reference to its work for the Trump election campaign and the referendum Leave campaign. That led to the second article featuring Cambridge Analytica – as a central node in the alternative news and information network that I believed Robert Mercer and Steve Bannon, the key Trump aide who is now his chief strategist, were creating. I found evidence suggesting they were on a strategic mission to smash the mainstream media and replace it with one comprising alternative facts, fake history and rightwing propaganda.
_________________________
"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#302335 - 07/15/17 03:40 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: logtroll]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16060
In Shakespeare's Henry VI, the conspirators knew that to usurp the throne they had to get rid of the institutions that supported the government. Bannon took the wrong lesson from that play, and his take is, First thing we do, let's kill all the journalists!
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#302337 - 07/15/17 10:05 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: NW Ponderer]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
KGB-type chess moves may even be to get Trump elected but much compromised, and THEN to announce it to the world to render him even more ineffective than he already was. All the revelations we are getting now are probably part of their plan.

Not to say they are not true: Trump is badly compromised, but it is even better for them if everybody knows that. Republican Congressmen's failure to impeach him is playing right into their plans, instead of quickly dumping him.

Which leads us to the question, which is better for Putin: America run by a competent but fairly friendly Democratic Party, or run by an incompetent but unfriendly Republican Party. (I'm thinking post Russian-operated Trump.)

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#302379 - 07/19/17 01:53 AM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pondering_it_all]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16060
Trump gets new instructions from his Russian handler... Trump, Putin had second, undisclosed talk at G-20.
Quote:
According to Tuesday reports, in their second conversation, Trump spoke with the Russian leader for roughly an hour, joined only by Putin's translator. The meeting had previously gone without mention by the administration.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

Top
#302380 - 07/19/17 02:45 AM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pdx rick]
rporter314 Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 6434
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Unfortunately we will never get the truth of the content of the meeting. Mr Trump will lie about it and Putin will lie about it and the translator .... well ... he died of polonium poisonings yesterday

Again I will auto flagellate. I never imagined a narcissist would believe he is superior to the devious expertise in manipulations of a trained KGB agent. I suspect believes he is so smart he can out maneuver Putin. He may have given away the keys to the backdoor and the password to the security vault.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty

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#302382 - 07/19/17 12:43 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pdx rick]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16060
Trump IS a Russian agent.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

Top
#302383 - 07/19/17 01:48 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: NW Ponderer]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8809
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
Trump IS a Russian agent.

That he is, as well as many of his closest cohorts:

Foreign agent definition

Quote:
Under the 2012 Russian foreign agent law, nongovernmental organizations have to designate themselves "foreign agents" in all external communication if they engage in "political activity" and receive any foreign funding.

Perhaps another reason Trump won't release his tax records...
_________________________
"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#302386 - 07/20/17 03:54 AM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pdx rick]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16060
After today, I'm pretty sure Mueller is closing in.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

Top
#302389 - 07/20/17 10:29 PM Re: Trump and Russia [Re: pdx rick]
matthew Offline
newbie

Registered: 03/24/16
Posts: 353
'
The real estate trickster goes bankrupt in 2008; No American banks will bail him out because they know from bitter experience that Trump is a cheat and a louse.

His only hope to survive is to get huge loans from shady Russian Mafiosi and their German go-fers.

Do you think they permitted Trump to survive out of the goodness of their hearts, without putting their talons into his flesh, and demanding that he toe the line?

Anyone who believes that has the mind of an imbecile and the naivete of a child !
.
_________________________
Once, weapons were manufactured to fight wars; today, wars are manufactured to sell weapons

It is far easier to deceive folks than to convince them they are deceived

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