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#303917 - 11/13/17 09:24 PM sex assaults
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2033
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I was waiting for somebody to post on this but, I guess, I will do it. I am finding this whole thing to be kinda strange, from my view of it all. I am not spring chicken and I have watched guys grope, grip, pat, pet, touch, women for a very long time. People are treating this as if its a brand new thing - it is not. This is a cultural thing and most men know it and know men who do it. have some very good friends who we have known for over 50 years. The husband has been groping my wife for all those years (well, not anymore, he is now 95 and not up to it anymore). I once asked my wife if she wanted me to say anything and she said; "Its no problem, I am used to it and he isn't the only one." I went on to ask her about the whole thing as, at the time, I knew it happened but just never figured it out. My wife, on the other hand, had it figured out pretty good. She also said that if it ever passed a line (at the time I guess there was a line and some was tolerated) she would take care of it so I just let it pass.

My point is that this is a cultural thing that has been going on for a very long time. Its like growing up, being in high school, and noticing that the guys who got the ladies were the same as the guys who treated them like sh**. I never figured that one out either (I was a bit slow and never did it because I feared what would happen and just didn't have the guts (fortunately, as I look back).

Now, I think, its getting stopped. The ladies seem to have, finally, had enough and want to be done with. I have talked about this with some that I know and they, for the most part, admitted they might have "used to do some of that" but had stopped long ago in fear of their wives.

My point is that this is a cultural thing and comes in somewhere around the 'manly' category. The current victimizer of note is Roy Moore, a genuine piece of work who made his bones by being VERY religious and VERY male! (manly) He got where he is by mouthing religious nonsense and speaking directly to the Lord. Its REALLY time for him to get shut down!

Anyway, guys who do this don't think its all that wrong and I have know some who are actually bewildered. I think, however, that its becoming clear that its not only a bad thing to do but dangerous as hell!

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#303918 - 11/14/17 12:27 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
NW Ponderer Offline
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Registered: 09/09/11
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There has always been a certain segment of our society that felt that this was a privilege of males. There have always been "lines" and there have always been those who regularly cross the lines. What some defined as "flirting" or "hitting on" was verbal, and some women have always felt that it was harassing and degrading, but some guys don't get it, and never have or will. Some are perfectly willing to get physical, and even forceful.

There have always been levels of intrusion, beginning with unsolicited advances (and cat calls) and progressing through harassment, assault, and rape. Different cultures have always had differing approaches to dealing with it.

What we have currently, is a cultural sea change, and I think, largely, we can credit/blame Donald Trump - and before him, Bill Clinton. The concept of sexual harassment and hostile work environment (or at least the terms) are relatively new.
Quote:
The concept of sexual harassment, in its modern understanding, is a relatively new one, dating from the 1970s onwards; although other related concepts have existed prior to this in many cultures. According to Judy Woodruff on the November 10, 2017 edition of the NPR News Hour, "Lin Farley is an author, journalist and noted feminist. She's credited with coining the term sexual harassment in the 1970's." The term sexual harassment was used in 1973 in "Saturn's Rings", a report authored by Mary Rowe to the then-President and Chancellor of the Massachusetts Institute of Technology (MIT) about various forms of gender issues.
Wikipedia. See also A Brief History of Sexual Harassment in America Before Anita Hill - TIME; A Brief History of Sexual Harassment in the United States - NOW; and A Short History of Sexual Harassment - REVA B. SIEGEL.

I think what caused the dam to break was the election of Donald Trump following the publication of the "Access Hollywood" video/audio. There was a significant, and I think genuine, wave of disgust even in Republican circles. The female half of the population finally said "enough." Harvey Weinstein's predations were particularly appalling, but there was an ocean's worth of magma boiling beneath the surface just waiting to erupt. In virtually every sphere of modern culture the eruptions have occurred.
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#303919 - 11/14/17 12:57 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Ted Remington Offline
old hand

Registered: 07/09/08
Posts: 4939
In re Moore:

Try this on for a nightmare scenario:

Moore stays in the race and narrowly defeats Jones. He then goes to the Senate, which excludes him/refuses to seat him. The seat is vacant so the Republican Governor appoints Luther Strange to fill the remainder of Moore's six year term.

This is why they don't want Moore to withdraw. They keep the seat no matter who sits in it. If Moore withdraws now Jones is the likely winner.
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#303921 - 11/14/17 02:37 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
There's flirtation and there's abuse. They really are two very different things. Abuse involves some sort of power imbalance that makes the aggressor (usually but not always make) think they can force the victim to cooperate. Which makes actual rape unnecessary. But it really is a form of rape, just non-violent.

That's what a 30 year old adult DA can do with a 14 or 16 year old girl. He maybe never saw it as rape because he never held them down and tore their panties off, but they saw it as rape.

I bet he was careful to only find victims with single mothers, because if a father was around Ol' Roy would be missing some vital bits. This latest victim reinforces this idea: She told her mother and sister at the time, but there's no mention of a father.

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#303922 - 11/14/17 03:52 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Ujest Shurly Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/16/16
Posts: 314
Loc: Sterling Heights, MI, USA
I beg to differ; this is not a cultural thing, but a species thing. I have seen it happen in Germany, England, France, Spain, United States, Canada, Honduras, Panama, San Salvador, Mexico, Japan, South Korea, Taiwan and Vietnam. I have seen and heard of both males and females suffering this assault by both males and females. Does not make it right, it is wrong no matter who does it. It is like Rape, it is a crime of power and sickness.
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#303923 - 11/14/17 04:04 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
NW Ponderer Offline
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Registered: 09/09/11
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I differ with your begging...

It is, if course, human to take advantage of advantages, and while something may exist nearly universally, how it is responded to is a cultural response. Most cultures in the world are patriarchal, some just more militantly so than others. Honor killings are widespread in places, but we recoil at the barbarity and wrong-headedness of it (because it's so uncivilized). Victim-blaming and revenge porn are a couple of our "norms", but even those are being fought vigorously - and legally.

I'm suggesting that our culture is changing - in fits and starts, mind you, and with vast regional differences. A decade ago homosexuality was punished civilly and criminally in most of the United States. Now gay marriage is accepted almost everywhere. More and more people are rejecting patriarchal extremism in favor of equality. It takes time, but the direction is good. Rome wasn't built - or destroyed - in a day. I'm just personally excited to see it happening at all.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#303926 - 11/14/17 06:10 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
The latest Roy Moore story is that he was banned from the Gadsden Mall when he was 30, for hitting on teenage girls. Local police and several people who worked there knew it, and are willing to talk to reporters about it. I think this may be the proverbial straw on the camel's back for Ol' Roy.

And I hear that "endorsement by 53 pastors" thingie was actually released by his wife and predates all this child molester stuff.

Buh bye.

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#303930 - 11/14/17 07:32 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2033
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
All I can say about Mr. Moore is that he is going to reap the whirlwind. They have already started slyly attacking the accusers but its so obvious that its not going to hurt the offended much unless they back off and that doesn't look like its going to happen. This man is not only a sexual predator but a man who has used his religion to get ahead. People like this are the very worst of the worst and need to go. The proof of this is his treatment of girls. If he was so holy, and talked directly to the lord, and practiced what he preached it would be one thing but, instead the man lies and is a jackass, not unlike his hero the chief liar and jackass Donald Trump.

He will never, of course, be seated in the senate. Can you imagine what would happen if he was in the senate for a year, being covered constantly for using his talents for lying and jackassing? Any Republican running after something like that would lose their jobs and, for sure, one things politicians will not tolerate is ANY threat to them and their jobs and Mr. Moore is a genuine threat to them all.

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#303943 - 11/16/17 01:30 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 389
Loc: Upstate NY
The latest Alabama poll has Moore down by 12 points.

New alleged assaults continue to come out of the "wood"wurk, including grab-ass incidents after he was married! Mrs Moore delivered the most dreaded message known to men, to duh Judge: Honey, we have to talk!

I dont understand why Judge Moore doesn't just end all this controversy with the very simple act of going on TV and swearing to God and Jesus, on his Bible, that all of these claims are unfounded, and that he is not a purvert.

My smiling muscles are aching from considering t-rumps dilemma of supporting or condemning Moore from the standpoint of sexual predictor/creeper in chief!

Sad ROTFMOL
Tat
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#303944 - 11/16/17 03:31 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
No, the evangelical way is to go on TV and admit he's sinned.

"I asked Jesus for forgiveness, and I'm trying to lead a better life."

A couple of years without repeated incidents and Ol' Roy would be rehabilitated.

This kind of thing started with St. Augustine: "Lord, save me from sin, but not yet!"

Of course it's pretty easy not to hit on teens once your parts don't work anymore.

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#303946 - 11/16/17 04:27 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA


I verbally sexually assault guys all of the time. So what? Hmm

I tell them how handsome and sexy they are. How I would "turn" them. How I would rock their world. devil

Turn about is fair play. coffee

(In some small way, I hope they realize what I am doing to them, they've done to woman countless of times, themselves. smile )
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#303948 - 11/16/17 08:23 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Just as I expected, they're coming out accusing Moore in a tidal wave of teenage victims. You don't get banned from a mall after just hitting on one high school girl.

And Rick: I think hitting on men or women is fine, as long as they are adults. But when you are 30 and hitting on every high school girl in the county, there's something very wrong with you. Somebody needs to take you to the vet and get you neutered.

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#303950 - 11/16/17 12:15 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: pondering_it_all]
TatumAH Offline
newbie

Registered: 02/18/11
Posts: 389
Loc: Upstate NY
No that's too harsh, all
rick needs is some educational tutoring!
Tat

[img]https://www.pinterest.com/pin/135037688797148689/[/img]
_________________________
There's nothing wrong with thinking
Except that it's lonesome work
sevil regit

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#303955 - 11/16/17 07:11 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: pondering_it_all]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
And Rick: I think hitting on men or women is fine, as long as they are adults. But when you are 30 and hitting on every high school girl in the county, there's something very wrong with you. Somebody needs to take you to the vet and get you neutered.

I have always maintained that elementary and high school boys are safe from me - it's their dads who aren't safe from me. laugh
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#303976 - 11/17/17 01:22 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Yeah, conservatives seem to think the gayz are all going to molest their preteen sons. Back in the real world, gay men are usually attracted to manly muscular adult men. Sometimes they wistfully look at manly muscular adult straight men and think if only, but that's about it in terms of inappropriate sex partners.

This has been the case for a VERY long time. Just look at Tom of Finland drawings to see the standard of gay fantasy iconography!

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#304035 - 11/21/17 12:32 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA

Et tu, Charlie Rose? cry
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#304036 - 11/21/17 12:36 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA

...the one thing that prevented me from be a sexual harasser/groper (...because I probably am down deep inside - let's be honest smile ) is that a guy would have probably beat me up. gobsmacked

Perhaps if more women hauled-off and punched a guy - less guys would be doing this kinda stuff. Just saying. Hmm
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#304037 - 11/21/17 01:49 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
Greger Online   content

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 14039
Loc: Florida
I think it can be said that all men would like to grope people they are attracted to. A firm derriere or a nice pair of tetitas are awfully tempting, but most of us have sense enough to keep our hands to ourselves and keep the groping safely in our imaginations where it belongs.
But there is a certain sort of man who thinks women want them as much as they want women, that women want to be touched by them as much as they want to do the touching, even most of these guys keep their hands to themselves. But when you add in a mix of power, wealth, and bloated egos sometimes common sense flies out the window entirely.
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#304038 - 11/21/17 03:12 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA

It is said that Charlie Rose walked around naked, in his apartment, in front of his female assistant.

Really? Seriously Charlie? rolleyes , nono , Hmm
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#304039 - 11/21/17 03:39 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA


Now John Conyers. This isn't stopping for a while. coffee
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#304040 - 11/21/17 04:18 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1662
Loc: Middle, USA
Roy Moore really really really NEEDS to get into the Senate so all of us taxpayers can pitch in to pay off the ladies he stalked/harassed/molested, most in their teens, without us knowing about it or any names being named.

Sweet deal.
_________________________
Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#304045 - 11/21/17 07:40 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2033
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I stand, foursquare, behind getting Roy Moore into the senate. Moore and Trump running their mouths! I think they are probably capable of pissing off about 90% of the population. It would be better for the dems than just about anything the dems themselves could do, and the media would cover it all with gusto for free! It would be like late night comedy 24 hours a day!

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#304054 - 11/22/17 02:07 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
This isn't stopping for a while.


Like I said, I bet at least 90% of the men in Congress have some skeleton in their closet. You don't run for national office without enough ego and self confidence, and willingness to take risks. Those traits naturally lead men to take risks in other aspects of life, including sexual risks.

But there's a huge difference between men hitting on women and perverts going after teens.

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#304086 - 11/24/17 05:03 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Also, a huge difference between hitting on a woman and cornering her for purposes of intimidation, or to demand sexual favors in an atmosphere of intimidation.

The former is just "making a pass" and no matter how clumsy or sloppy, it's neither a crime, nor harassment, it's just a guy who wants to get intimate with a woman.
Some do it better than others, almost all have experienced rejection more often than not, and it's entirely acceptable.
The latter is a "crime of power" and the goal is not so much sexual satisfaction as it is the feeling of power over a helpless woman. This is the money shot, not sexual ecstasy. This is the climax, not foreplay.

Once a man's advances are rejected, normal males get the message and move on, aberrant males interpret it as a signal of disrespect or a cue to become aggressive.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304133 - 11/26/17 08:23 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2033
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
It dawns on me that people getting assaulted also have a responsibility in this. There is a current discussion about the gov paying off the assaulted and keeping it all a secret. The basic problem is that what we are experiencing, right now, the discussions over assault, is that, had everybody had been speaking up, contemporaneously, this would not be happening right now. The gov paying off the assaulted is interesting because they are also talking about keeping the identities of the assaulted secret. Sorry, this just won't do. I think everybody agrees that to stop it, its got to be reported and reported publicly. Once that happens there has to be a process established to verify the charges. I have no idea how this might work but to continue to rely on "he said, she said" to be the process is just plain silly. To be concerned over the identifying the assaulted is like being concerned over identifying a rape victim. I think we have moved far away from blaming a rape victim for being raped and the same should apply to the assaulted. The difference between the two is that one is objectively proven and the other, right now, mostly boils down to "he said, she said" and we need a better method of verification.

When we are told a story about how somebody was assaulted 40 years ago I have a real problem with the whole thing. Hopefully we are over with that stuff now and, hopefully, those assaulted will speak up in a timely manner. Many of the current cases involve stuff that happened, years ago, and was never mentioned to anybody but immediate family or close friends with the promise of keeping it a secret. The ONLY reason this stuff is getting attention is because of the sheer number of assaulted coming forward and this is a good thing! I would hope that coming forward will now be a responsibility of the assaulted and considered that to be the case. We should also remember that most of this stuff has been, historically, something guys do and, except in extreme instances gets ignored. Now, I betcha that is gone too and the manly idiots will now understand that its not something guys do anymore. If this becomes true then, as far as I am concerned, its all worth it. There is going to be some unfairness happening and this is unfortunate but part of the deal. If those who do this kind of stuff have a brain in their heads they have to understand that if they act out they are going to have serious problems, fair or not. The secret, of course, remains to keep your hands to yourself. That has always been the gold standard and that remains.

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#304134 - 11/26/17 08:54 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Maybe every woman needs to wear a recording body camera, so it is never again "he said, she said". It's certainly within out abilities now. We could even issue them to every girl at age 10, for free. Make them all upload to the cloud, so removing a woman's camera is preserved evidence of an assault.

The footage could even be viewed by an AI, to preserve privacy. If the AI thinks it is detecting an assault, it refers it to a human to look at. It would certainly deter pedophiles!

But the main point is that there would always be evidence if somebody later called foul. It might even save a lot of men whose partners called "RAPE" after they got mad at them. Which while rare, does happen.

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#304136 - 11/26/17 09:33 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1662
Loc: Middle, USA
My friend and I have speculated that Roy Moore has a really really teeny wienie. We think he wanted to marry a young virgin. That way, unless she was unfaithful, she'd never know what she was missing.
_________________________
Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#304141 - 11/27/17 05:44 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: Spag-hetti]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Spag-hetti
My friend and I have speculated that Roy Moore has a really really teeny wienie. We think he wanted to marry a young virgin. That way, unless she was unfaithful, she'd never know what she was missing.


Either a teeny weenie, or he's a Minute Man, or a total slob who doesn't even give a damn about female satisfaction, or all three.
I'm betting all three.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304163 - 11/30/17 04:24 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1662
Loc: Middle, USA
Roy Moore gave a political speech in a church. Isn't the church supposed to lose its tax exemption?
_________________________
Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#304168 - 11/30/17 09:37 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
I think Trump and Co. just gutted that one, no?
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304180 - 12/01/17 02:13 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Spag-hetti Offline
member

Registered: 09/10/08
Posts: 1662
Loc: Middle, USA
I'd heard he made a pronouncement, but I hadn't heard about a vote or the change of a law or the alteration of the Constitution or whatever it would take to change it.
_________________________
Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.

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#304184 - 12/01/17 10:49 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Right at this moment I see the entire issue playing out like some newfound religious gospel, wherein every sin is counted up as being the same in its measure, every evangelist is counted up as being a saint, every gospel preached as being sacred and unimpeachable and everyone who questions the new evangel in even the slightest way as being a heretic.

That doesn't mean that we don't have a multitude of sins to account for or that we should not seek redemption or rethink our place in the world. It doesn't mean that the bones of this new evangel are not rooted in a certain reasonable amount of logic and spiritual soundness.
It does mean however, that we are, at this point in time, far too enamored of the more charismatic aspects of this new sexual eschatology and that we are trending toward having a deaf ear for the subtleties and deeper meanings, and we're crusading along with our blunt instrument and laying waste to all sinners large and small by applying the same approach, that of lopping off their head while swinging our banner high.

I urge everyone to use a lot more care in researching these allegations, and to take the time to take a deeper look. These egregious acts, predatory behavior, harassment, sexual assault, all speak for themselves. They are shameful and can be spotted in a minute.

To the careful observer, they should stand out and stand apart clearly from ordinary interactions that make up the complex dance of the sexes.

And while you may find some of those more ordinary interactions distasteful, or clumsy, and while some may be coming from a place you feel is less than sincere and erudite, they are not crimes.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304279 - 12/07/17 07:42 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
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Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2033
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I have been giving a bit more thought to this one. I tend to believe that stuff that happened over 10 years ago, with no evidence it has continued since then should be made public so that that bad guy can say he is sorry but that's it, unless there was physical harm folks should just get over it. Right now it just doesn't matter. The severity of the act doesn't seem to matter, the fact that the behavior has not happened in over 10 years doesn't matter, most remain in the demesne of "he said, she said", etc. Right now, instead, the range of activities seems to be everything from a pat and a hug to outright rape and EACH ONE is as bad as the other and the fact that the miscreant stopped such behavior for 10 years, or longer, also makes no difference. Its as if the female race is out to make up for the centuries of abuse overnight. Anybody accused is flat out guilty of whatever and needs to not only be contrite, apologize, etc. but be utterly destroyed.

Sorry, this simply does not make any sense. I am certainly not a big Roy Moore fan but I think his mouth is a LOT more offensive, hateful, destructive and just wrong, than actions that had happened 40 years ago.

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#304283 - 12/07/17 08:32 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pdx rick


I verbally sexually assault guys all of the time. So what? Hmm

I tell them how handsome and sexy they are. How I would "turn" them. How I would rock their world. devil

Turn about is fair play. coffee

(In some small way, I hope they realize what I am doing to them, they've done to woman countless of times, themselves. smile )


Bullshit, Rick.
If what you're talking about is anything like the way you taunt me, that isn't sexual harassment, at least not to ME, or even my WIFE, who erupts in peals of laughter whenever I read what you said aloud.

Since I pretty much LIVE FOR her laughter and that adorable little smile she gets on her face from time to time, I couldn't call what you do sexual harassment.

Now, if you leaned in and tried to grab my junk, or tried to corner me somewhere, that would qualify.

There's a male nurse at the Long Beach VA who is also clearly attracted to my "bear" attributes.
He sees me and it's like I'm some kind of MAGNET. That 65 year old guy picks up his gait and he's on me like white on rice, his arm around my shoulder, "How ARE you? You're looking GREAT, are you working out or something?" his face almost "up in my grille".

Even THAT...it's a little tough for me to call it harassment.
He's clearly crushing on me, it's a wee bit uncomfortable but I'll get over it, and again, watching my wife's reaction is priceless and maybe it even makes the whole thing worthwhile.
She even gives me hugs after my "little buddy" leaves..."Oh my poor hubby, what is it about you anyway HAHAHA"

Yeah, I think I'd have to pull him up short if he went further.
"Hey big guy, I don't roll that way, okay?"

But he doesn't...I guess he thinks he's staying behind some self defined boundary, one which apparently includes putting his arm around me and getting close enough for me to wonder if I should have used mouthwash that morning. But he never crosses it, and he clearly is trying to be friendly, and he treats my wife very nicely.

Who knows, maybe he thinks poor Jayeff isn't getting any at home because of "his crippled wife" (far from the truth) and he wants me to know he's available.
I don't know, don't wanna know, and I might even be more uncomfortable if it wasn't for the fact that Karen gets a hoot out of watching the whole thing happen, which is every other time we go to the VA, I guess.

Just my two cents.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304285 - 12/07/17 09:49 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8809
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Sounds to me like someone is tempted...
_________________________
"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#304289 - 12/08/17 01:58 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
I couldn't call what you do sexual harassment.

Ok, stud. smile

Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
There's a male nurse at the Long Beach VA who is also clearly attracted to my "bear" attributes.

He sees me and it's like I'm some kind of MAGNET. That 65 year old guy picks up his gait and he's on me like white on rice, his arm around my shoulder, "How ARE you? You're looking GREAT, are you working out or something?" his face almost "up in my grille".

Isn't he supposed to be taking care of Karen? He's all..."Hi Karen."

(Then turns his attention all to you. blush )
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#304290 - 12/08/17 01:59 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
You can think you are perfectly straight and then you see a movie with 20 year old Brad Pitt, and think: "Oh My", as George Takei put it. Not that you would do anything, but if you had to have a cellmate...

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#304291 - 12/08/17 02:04 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pdx rick

Isn't he supposed to be taking care of Karen? He's all..."Hi Karen."

(Then turns his attention all to you. blush )


LOL! LOL ROTFMOL LOL
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304292 - 12/08/17 02:05 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: logtroll]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Sounds to me like someone is tempted...


Nope, don't want none of that "stick kitty".
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304294 - 12/08/17 02:12 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pondering_it_all]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
You can think you are perfectly straight and then you see a movie with 20 year old Brad Pitt, and think: "Oh My", as George Takei put it. Not that you would do anything, but if you had to have a cellmate...


I was too busy drooling over the idea of making Geena Davis get her hair all messed up.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304296 - 12/08/17 02:51 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
You can think you are perfectly straight and then you see a movie with 20 year old Brad Pitt, and think: "Oh My", as George Takei put it. Not that you would do anything, but if you had to have a cellmate...


I was too busy drooling over the idea of making Geena Davis get her hair all messed up.

I woulda watched that. smile
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#304298 - 12/08/17 04:02 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: pdx rick]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
You can think you are perfectly straight and then you see a movie with 20 year old Brad Pitt, and think: "Oh My", as George Takei put it. Not that you would do anything, but if you had to have a cellmate...


I was too busy drooling over the idea of making Geena Davis get her hair all messed up.

I woulda watched that. smile


Thelma and Louise, you never saw that movie?

THELMA
Hi.

She is shocked by Thelma's appearance.

LOUISE
What happened to your hair?

THELMA
Nothing...got messed up.

Louise is studying Thelma closely as
Thelma squirms in her
seat, barely able to contain herself.

LOUISE
What's wrong with you?

THELMA
Nothing. Why? Do I seem different?

LOUISE
Yes, now that you mention it. You
seem crazy. Like you're on drugs.

THELMA
Well, I'm not on drugs. But I might
be crazy.

LOUISE
(shaking her head)
I don't think I wanna hear what you're
gonna tell me.

Thelma is just about to shriek when the Waitress comes over
and puts a coffee cup on the table and pours some.

Thelma gets a grip on herself for a moment then loses it as
the Waitress goes away.

THELMA
Oh my God, Louise!!! I can't believe
it! I just really can't believe it!
I mean... whoa!

Thelma is just laughing hysterically. Louise suddenly
understands.

LOUISE
Oh, Thelma. Oh, no.

THELMA
I mean I finally understand what all
the fuss is about. This is just a
whole 'nother ball game!

LOUISE
Thelma, please get a hold of yourself.
You're making a spectacle.

THELMA
You know, Louise, you're supposed to
be my best friend. You could at
least be a little bit happy for me.
You could at least pretend to be
slightly happy that for once in my
life I have a sexual experience that
isn't completely disgusting.

LOUISE
I'm sorry. I am happy. I'm very
happy for you. You finally got laid
proper. It's about time. Where
is he now?

THELMA
Taking a shower.

LOUISE
You left that guy alone in the room?
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304299 - 12/08/17 04:47 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8809
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Sounds to me like someone is tempted...

Nope, don't want none of that "stick kitty".

I will say that you didn't hit on me... at least not that I noticed. rolleyes
_________________________
"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#304300 - 12/08/17 05:38 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: logtroll]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Sounds to me like someone is tempted...

Nope, don't want none of that "stick kitty".

I will say that you didn't hit on me... at least not that I noticed. rolleyes


Karen thought you were pretty cute, though. wink
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304305 - 12/08/17 01:15 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8809
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Sounds to me like someone is tempted...

Nope, don't want none of that "stick kitty".

I will say that you didn't hit on me... at least not that I noticed. rolleyes

Karen thought you were pretty cute, though. wink

Maybe I should have spent the night...
_________________________
"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#304307 - 12/08/17 04:30 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: logtroll]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16061
The Uneven Playing Field - Dahlia Lithwick, Slate. "Sure, donít stoop to their level. But letís acknowledge that the game Republicans are forcing everyone to play insists morality is for losers."
Quote:
In this parade of unilateral disarmament, Trump stays, Conyers goes, Moore stays, Franken goes.

Is this the principled solution? By every metric I can think of, itís correct. But itís also wrong. Itís wrong because we no longer inhabit a closed ethical system, in which morality and norm preservation are their own rewards. We live in a broken and corroded system in which unilateral disarmament is going to destroy the very things we want to preserve.
....The point is, as Jennifer Rubin notes Tuesday, that ďone party has adopted a zero-tolerance position (with Sen. Al Franken, Democrat of Minnesota, set to go before the ethics committee) and another party opens its arms to people it believes are miscreants.Ē Rubin feels confident that becoming the party of alleged sexual abusers will harm the GOP in upcoming elections (did she live through last November?). My own larger concern is that becoming the party of high morality will allow Democrats to live with themselves but that the party is also self-neutering in the face of unprecedented threats, in part to do the right thing and in part to take ammunition away from the rightóa maneuver that never seems to work out these days. When Al Franken, who has been a champion for womenís rights in his tenure in the Senate, leaves, what rushes in to fill the space may well be a true feminist. But it may also be another Roy Moore. And there is something deeply naÔve, in a game of asymmetrical warfare, and in a moment of unparalleled public misogyny, in assuming that the feminist gets the seat before it happens.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#304330 - 12/09/17 09:30 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
On the other hand, the governor of Minnesota is a Democrat and there are several competent people with elective office experience who can be appointed in Franken's place. Including several women. It's not like the Democrats lose the vote in the Senate. They just lose Franken's obvious effectiveness. But if all of this makes him ineffective, then somebody else can be.

And Franken can go home, write another book, and prepare for a 2020 run for President. A man with his record is fully qualified, according to Republicans. In fact, maybe he should run as a Republican. LOL

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#304331 - 12/09/17 09:43 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Mark Dayton pulled the biggest bonehead move imaginable, PIA.
He wants a "caretaker" to assume Franken's seat till 2018, which in and of itself leaves that seat open to a certain Republican challenge, and an all-but-inevitable win.
He should have appointed a PIT BULL, preferably a female pit bull, one that would inspire Minnesota Democrats to keep her.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304332 - 12/09/17 09:44 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: pondering_it_all]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13202
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all

And Franken can go home, write another book, and prepare for a 2020 run for President. A man with his record is fully qualified, according to Republicans. In fact, maybe he should run as a Republican. LOL


The only way that will happen is if he is able to clear his name either in court, or IN the Senate, which he is now leaving.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#304398 - 12/12/17 01:26 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 40930
Loc: Puget Sound, WA

The sixteen...erm, nineteen (now) ladies are taking another bite of the apple, they want a Congressional investigation of the Toothless Bloated Orange Puss-Grabber.
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#304401 - 12/12/17 06:53 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Interesting opinion floating around: Republicans in Congress are hoping like Hell Roy loses. Because if he wins they either have to expel him (and piss off all the Trump fans and Alabama voters) or not and get to wear him like a stinking dead albatross around their necks in future elections.

A Real Live Senator Moore could be the greatest thing ever for a Democratic sweep and subsequent impeachment. And you think everybody in the Senate hates Ted Cruz...

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#304410 - 12/12/17 04:57 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Online   content

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 14039
Loc: Florida
Quote:
wear him like a stinking dead albatross around their necks in future elections.

They already have so many stinking dead albatross' around their necks they can barely stand. It hasn't slowed them down a bit and I don't expect Senator Moore will either.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."ó Oscar Wilde

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#304425 - 12/13/17 06:07 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: Greger]
Ken Condon Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 06/14/07
Posts: 3818
Loc: Eugene, OR
Seems the stinking albatross lei had some effect here. Assuming the proposed recount does not serve to further fowl the atmosphere..

If this character Moore is indeed disposed from the scene it will be a great day. But if that proves to be true I also fear itís just for a moment. These people are not going away--and they are not going away without a fight to the Finish.

..............Swedes need not apply.
_________________________
Get your facts first, then you can distort them as you please.

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#304426 - 12/13/17 12:11 PM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16061
Is the tide actually rolling in a different direction?
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#304769 - 01/02/18 12:13 AM Re: sex assaults [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7692
Loc: North San Diego County
Seems #MeToo is evolving into something permanent and dangerous to the scumbags:

Hollywood Heroines Launch Initiative To Fight Sexual Harassment And Inequality

Quote:
Over 300 women who work in television, film and theater launched a far-reaching campaign Monday that includes the creation of a legal defense fund to help less-privileged women come forward about sexual misconduct theyíve experienced.

The Timeís Up Legal Defense Fund, backed by $13 million in donations from over 200 donors, is spearheaded by high-profile attorneys Roberta Kaplan and Tina Tchen, who previously worked as former first lady Michelle Obamaís chief of staff.

Tchen pointed to the #MeToo movement as a major catalyst for the initiative.

Donnie: They're coming for you...

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