Current Topics
RoundTable for January 2019
by pondering_it_all
Today at 06:37 AM
The Shutdown Is Mitch McConnell's Fault
by NW Ponderer
Today at 02:40 AM
Is it too soon to be talking 2020?
by Greger
Today at 01:34 AM
No. 11 goes to Cooperstown: Edgar Martinez is finally a Hall of Famer
by NW Ponderer
Today at 01:18 AM
Trump administration fights humanity
by pondering_it_all
Today at 12:35 AM
shutdown confusion
by pondering_it_all
Today at 12:28 AM
The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist?
by Greger
Yesterday at 11:55 PM
Right to life march
by jgw
Yesterday at 07:04 PM
Justice is coming
by pondering_it_all
01/21/19 08:10 PM
Miscellaneous humor thread
by pondering_it_all
01/21/19 07:56 PM
It is time to consider impeachment
by jgw
01/21/19 07:49 PM
A Judge Blocked the Census From Asking About Citizenship. Here's Why It Matters
by Greger
01/19/19 04:55 PM
The Green New Deal, explained
by jgw
01/18/19 10:20 PM
‘Forgiveness is better:’ SC restaurant owner poses with man who robbed business
by Golem
01/18/19 05:42 PM
William Barr should be a convict, not Attorney General
by NW Ponderer
01/18/19 05:13 PM
Collusion has now been shown. What now?
by pondering_it_all
01/17/19 12:12 AM
The Passing Parade: Obituaries: 2019
by Golem
01/16/19 06:15 PM
Gregory Benford Wins 2019 Robert A. Heinlein Award
by Golem
01/15/19 07:07 PM
Trump's Wall Shutdown IS his policy
by pondering_it_all
01/14/19 06:59 PM
GoFundMe Wall campaign collapses: fraud campaign substituted
by pondering_it_all
01/12/19 07:20 PM
Forum Stats
6248 Members
58 Forums
16469 Topics
283885 Posts

Max Online: 294 @ 12/06/17 12:57 AM
Google Adsense
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Topic Options
#304842 - 01/04/18 03:30 AM Re: Capitalism [Re: pondering_it_all]
chunkstyle Offline

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 1245
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
Imperialism versus hegemony, what difference does it make? A helluva difference to the citizens of that country! Imperial Spain dominated, plundered, and enslaved other countries for centuries. After WW II the US occupied Japan and Germany for a few years and gave them working democratic governments. Try telling Japanese or German citizens there's no difference.

Kindly turn your attention to Iraq, Syria, Iran, Libya, Chili, El Salvadore, you get the picture. I guess it's not been centuries so there's that point. I doubt the citizens of these places would take comfort knowing they got them a hegemony problem and not your much worse imperial problem.

Edited by chunkstyle (01/04/18 03:31 AM)

#304850 - 01/04/18 03:04 PM Re: Capitalism [Re: jgw]
chunkstyle Offline

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 1245
The old question of wether capitalism serves society or society serve capitalism has been answered in a number of ways.
The ability to contract between a corporate entity and individual is almost impossible with 'unilateral modification' clauses in most any service we subscribe to.
Forced arbitration clauses denying a citizens right to trial.
Tax exemptions for corporations.
Ability to headquarter yourself to a Caribbean island postal box address or English Channel Island zip code and avoid any taxes.
Incarcerating people for money in the For Profit Prisons. Pay politicians to enact laws to keep the steady stream of bodies from school to jail unabated. Non-violent drug offenders being the most profitable to jail.
Contracting with large corporation to use prison labor (our internal colonizing)

There is much agreement between the left and right on these issues and many more.
'Take our country back' has its roots in these unfair constructs of our current corporate state.
If we have any chance of putting society before profits we must make common cause and get over the partisan political traps to divide the citizenry.
Start by reforming campaign finance. There's something we can all agree on!

Edited by chunkstyle (01/04/18 03:27 PM)

#304852 - 01/04/18 04:03 PM Re: Capitalism [Re: chunkstyle]
NW Ponderer Offline
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16459
I happen to love tapioca. It is made from cassava root. But, to be edible, it must be properly prepared, or it can kill you. It contains cyanide. Capitalism is like cassava. It naturally contains a deadly poison. It has to be properly prepared, or it can kill you. Used in very small doses, under proper supervision, capitalism is literally like any other chemical additive - many are harmless or even beneficial, but they can become addictive and deadly. We have a capitalism problem and we need an intervention.
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

#304865 - 01/04/18 08:22 PM Re: Capitalism [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2253
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I suspect that the unmitigated greed of, apparently, most capitalists need serious regulation. Its also pretty well agreed that what sends capitalism off the rails is known. The problem is putting regulations in place that can control the more base activities and making them stick. I can remember when the financial regulations were put into place by the congress whilst, at the same time, there were Democratic congressmen virtually running stock operations out of their offices. Basically there is a genuine history of what happens when the Right takes over gov - their greed takes over and the economy tanks. The only Republican administration that actually staved off such was Reagan and he did it by raising taxes (the right forgets that St. Reagan actually did this). What they have been doing, under Trump, is going to be responsible for serious problems. I can only hope that the Left can stop their silly, get together, and win this year. If, however, they do not I suspect getting out of the market until after the resulting crash might be wise.

Its also been a mystery, to me, why the Left can't mention the history of Republicans and their magic with the economy. The Dems have a much better history, when it comes to debt, finance, etc.) yet they never toot their own horn and never mention the utter failure of the Republicans.

#304872 - 01/04/18 09:41 PM Re: Capitalism [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8167
Loc: North San Diego County
I wouldn't jump out of the market yet. This tax holiday could pay off very well for people who own stocks of companies with a lot of foreign profit they repatriate. The time to run away from the market is in November. Even if Trump is replaced, the Republicans with their tax bill are in control until 2019.

The Republicans will try to leave the Democrats a flaming bag of dog poop with a nail in it. That's what they always do.

Meanwhile: Companies with lots of foreign profit they can bring back
name profit dividend
pfizer 96% 3.74
cisco 38% 3.01
merck 37% 3.39
ge 32% 2.70
apple 29% 1.47
citigroup 28% 1.70
pepsico 28% 2.37

Edited by pondering_it_all (01/04/18 09:43 PM)

#304920 - 01/06/18 07:09 PM Re: Capitalism [Re: jgw]
chunkstyle Offline

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 1245
The problem with markets is they are based on a fallacy of perpetual growth. There are nosocial constraints except governments. I think we are witnessing the dismantling of government. It's been boughten.
The other constraint is material. Again, the mythology is that market forces will adapt to provide. History has examples otherwise.
Another warning to the world

Page 2 of 2 < 1 2

Who's Online
0 registered (), 50 Guests and 1 Spider online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
TrentonP, Nosf50, erumonej, Jensen Breck, Albertapkr
6248 Registered Users