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#305303 - 01/27/18 09:07 PM dems smelling blood
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2097
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
The Democratic party seems to be leaning towards candidates who can raise the bucks rather than candidates that can win. Its just nuts. Both parties, Dem and Republican we are told, are told, if they win that they must spend something like 40 hours a week raising more money rather than doing their jobs. I guess they get to practice that, before they get elected by raising money. Apparently this is the standard set to get the approval of the Democratic party.

These Idiots lost the last election and are, as far as I can see, working very hard to repeat the loss. Money is more important than views, beliefs, popularity, and everything else.

This one is not all that well known but its beginning to anger candidates who get ignored by the party. If they ain't raising the big bucks they are ignored. This money thing is going to turn off a lot of people who want to help, and want to run, but don't want to beg for money.


Edited by jgw (01/27/18 09:13 PM)

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#305308 - 01/27/18 11:33 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13267
Loc: Whittier, California
How else can one function in an environment where big money IS the WEATHER?
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#305311 - 01/28/18 12:24 AM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7886
Loc: North San Diego County
Tv time, radio time, internet presence, campaign signs, office rent, and so many other necessary things are not free. Gee, it would be swell if they were!

But they are not. So if you can't raise the money for all those things you will end up with many starry-eyed enthusiastic fans and somebody else who can raise the money winning the election.

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#305319 - 01/28/18 06:02 AM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
chunkstyle Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 965
Hillary raised more and spent more.

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#305321 - 01/28/18 07:28 AM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7886
Loc: North San Diego County
Only possible because Trump got so much free press coverage. Never happens in a Senate or House election involving ordinary people. Clinton/Trump was a Black Swan event. Even Trump did not really think he would win, which may be why he spent so sparingly. The guy who raises little money hardly ever wins. So while the ability to raise the most money should not determine the winner, the inability to be competitive almost always determines who loses. Everything else is wishful thinking.

Not that having new ideas, integrity, real ability, and experience are bad things. I want those in a candidate. But he or she should be able to attract enough supporters to be competitive in the race.

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#305324 - 01/28/18 02:33 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
chunkstyle Offline
journeyman

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 965
Maybe we should get the money out of politics and go with a federal funding system of elections. Maybe our politicians shouldn't have to go down on a rich tycoon in order to get elected.
Maintaining a neoliberal status quo has brought us to Trump. Clearly, judging by the current political calculus, it hasn't gone well for the 'third way' democrats. They have nothing to offer and don't really believe in anything other than maintaining status quo for the thin professional class.
At least republicans are selling grievance, indignation and a possibity of better times. That has more appeal than the grinding status quo of managed diminishing expectations.
The democrats lost all over the map even though they raised unprecedented monies in 2016. The state committees were starved for cash and there is almost no scaffolding at the local level. All that corporate cash got funneled to the national level and ultimately got pissed away to who knows where.
Supporting third way strategy is beating a dead horse.
Getting your boots on and hitting the streets old school is a winning strategy. Getting people to run with real democratic values has been winning. It's even made some states like Alaska go from deep red to purple.
Your backing a bankrupt and losing strategy.


Edited by chunkstyle (01/28/18 02:34 PM)

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#305325 - 01/28/18 07:28 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
NW Ponderer Online   content
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16203
I think, my friends, you have missed the latest news. Across the board, analysts are talking about the quality of the Democratic candidates being recruited. Not money-raiding prowess, but articulate, committed, and charismatic.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#305326 - 01/28/18 08:27 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: NW Ponderer]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline


Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 13267
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
I think, my friends, you have missed the latest news. Across the board, analysts are talking about the quality of the Democratic candidates being recruited. Not money-raiding prowess, but articulate, committed, and charismatic.


Thank you, it's not JUST sweeping both chambers of Congress, it's rooting out the detritus in the Democratic Party so that WHEN we come in, we come in with our A game, not the same old crap.
Yes, there ARE THOUSANDS of brand new people running for office all over the country, and they'll be the new ears and voice of the Democratic Party.

I wanted a Sanders crowdsourced Tea Party style takeover of the Dems but I'll take it any way I can get it. Gradual means carefully paced, so maybe gradual is better than a rage filled fever dream.

We need to bring our best messaging, and it needs to be more than how bad Trump is.
Less Captain Obvious and more Mister Wizard.
_________________________
"He wakes up in the morning, ****s all over Twitter, ****s all over us, ****s all over his staff, then hits golf balls."
---Congressman Peter King

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#305331 - 01/28/18 10:50 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7886
Loc: North San Diego County
Once we have a federal funding system of elections, then money won't matter. After they pass that legislation, get back to me. In the mean time (the rest of our lives, I presume), money DOES matter. I'm all for articulate, committed, and charismatic, but all those great qualities have to generate the enthusiasm and the cash to actually win.

Nobody has to go down on George Soros, but somebody has to make George Soros think the country would be better if these guys were running it, and that they have a chance at winning. You are going to turn off >95% of the American public with "I hate money." because even the poorest Americans love money. Against all odds and sanity, they keep voting for Republicans to lower taxes, because they plan on winning the lottery and don't want to pay a lot of taxes then!

Enthusiasm for progressive candidates is fine, but it doesn't win. You have to win. THEN you can make legislation to fund elections with federal money, among a great many other things. If you lose, it's never going to happen. To win the next Presidential election, Democrats need to find a moderate man who can scoop up votes from everybody to the left of The Freedom Caucus.

Some celebrity couldn't hurt: It worked fantastically for Trump. And who do the American people admire? Not Ralph Nader, even though he's worked tirelessly on progressive issues for decades. Gerry Brown? Too many people outside California dismiss all things California. George Clooney? He's got the activist credentials, the money, and the celebrity. He's been called one of the 100 most influential people on Earth by Time Magazine. And maybe best of all, he has zero political experience!

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#305332 - 01/28/18 10:58 PM Re: dems smelling blood [Re: jgw]
NW Ponderer Online   content
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16203
We are at an inflection point in American history. There is an opportunity for the Democrats to make significant inroads into rural America this election cycle, but it requires careful messaging, and significant policy choices. Rural America is ripe for a significant remake. Rural health systems, rural economic focus, small business relief. Avoid hot-button verbiage.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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