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RoundTable for Fall 2019
by pondering_it_all
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The Impeachment of Donald trump
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by perotista
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Public option vs Medicare for All
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auto industry, unions and strikes
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Where have all the conservatives gone?
by NW Ponderer
10/20/19 04:16 PM
What is "old"?
by Greger
10/19/19 03:03 AM
Never-Before-Seen Trump Tax Documents Show Major Inconsistencies
by pondering_it_all
10/19/19 02:26 AM
Hyper-partisanship and irrationality
by logtroll
10/19/19 12:47 AM
If ISIS does the unthinkable...
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10/18/19 01:09 PM
Are both "sides" equally corrupt?
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The Departed - 2019
by pdx rick
10/17/19 01:12 PM
Why do humans fight so much?
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Global warming predictions
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Turkey's Erdogan threatens to release millions of refugees into Europe over crit
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10/12/19 07:35 PM
Partisans' Trust in Legislative Branch Has Shifted in Past Year
by perotista
10/11/19 03:37 AM
Trump unleashes ISIS in Kurd Country
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10/10/19 05:31 PM
SF Board of Supervisors declare NRA a domestic terrorist organization
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10/09/19 03:08 PM
Is it too soon to be talking 2020?
by chunkstyle
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#307643 - 07/25/18 04:47 AM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: NW Ponderer]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 41835
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
Trump-Cohen tape released. Wanna know what a conspiracy sounds like? Proof that Trump and Giuliani flat out lied (and still are).

Yup. Bow

Supposedly, there are 12 more tapes. LOL
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#307644 - 07/25/18 04:48 AM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: Greger]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
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Loc: Puget Sound, WA

Glastonbury, Connecticut, McDonalds throws shade at brand-new Chick-fil-A opening next door to them:

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#307647 - 07/25/18 12:21 PM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: pondering_it_all]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 9474
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
I've considered many startups with electronic engineering products only to find that they could not succeed. I've been a principle investigator on three different Small Business Innovative Research grants.

Interesting, but how does that relate to having the same freedom to solicit investors as a rich person has? Were you unqualified to take products to commercialization because you lacked the "sophistication" that comes with being a millionaire?
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#307654 - 07/25/18 07:08 PM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: Greger]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8788
Loc: North San Diego County
No, you questioned my experience with startups and small (micro!) businesses, and I told you about it. And I could be a "qualified investor" if I wanted to be. I just have not found somebody else's business idea that I think is a sure thing lately. Instead I have real estate investments that are very low risk.

And in fact, moderate residential real estate is what I would recommend for anybody with $100,000 to invest. You let the rent you collect make the mortgage payments and by the time you retire you have a nice steady inflation-proof income. If you have a few million, then sure: Take a swing at some sort of brilliant startup idea.

I'm purposefully taking the investor's side here, instead of the entrepreneur's, since I think you are representing the entrepreneur's position well.

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#307656 - 07/25/18 08:49 PM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: pondering_it_all]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 9474
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Really, my only point is that having a million dollars isn't a realistic determinant between being "sophisticated" enough to invest without protections, or not. I think it is a sign of the irrational advantage we accord to people with money.

The rest of your comments about business startups and entrepreneurs is what I have been hearing from SBDC bureaucrats for decades, and my opinion (from my experience) is that they are just parroting clichťs, for the most part. They don't actually understand what the real issues are for small businesses, or have any useful advice beyond "write a business plan on go see if you can get a loan".
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#307657 - 07/25/18 11:04 PM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: Greger]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
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Loc: North San Diego County
Having a million dollars is a VERY good indicator that you made good investment choices in the past. Most people didn't make good choices and don't have a million dollars. When they win the lotto or inherit a big wad of cash, their choices are so bad they are poor again within a few years. The angel rule is there to protect them.

You may actually be able to use the Small Business Innovative Research program. They offer $50K for any government agency to fund an innovative project. With that grant, you have to write a very good business plan that details exactly how your new business would fulfill some agency's need. Agencies are everything from NASA to Department of Agriculture (which is probably the agency you want). The government publishes a big book every year of different agency's needs. You need to get a copy (maybe at a library) and look through it to see what USDA wants. My projects were from NASA to measure astronauts body volumes and USDA to estimate hog body volume using the same 3D computer vision system.

If the agency likes your report, then they can give you $500K to actually start the business! And that's not a loan. You never have to pay either the $50K or $500K back and you still own 100% of the business.

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#307659 - 07/25/18 11:58 PM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: pondering_it_all]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 9474
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Most people I know with a million bucks inherited it.

I am a two time Phase 1 SBIR grant recipient and one time Phase 2. I am writing another Phase 1 right now.

I would love to have 100 local folks invest $5,000 in commercializing one of my "products", but, alas, the SEC does not consider them to be "sophisticated" enough for the simple reason that they are not millionaires.


Edited by logtroll (07/26/18 12:04 AM)
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#307672 - 07/27/18 01:49 AM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: Greger]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8788
Loc: North San Diego County
I don't think you are really describing the investment type correctly: Angels (qualified investors) typically buy a large percentage of a startup. What you are describing is a Limited Liability Partnership. Investors could buy LP units for $5000, and you would be the managing General Partner. I don't think the SEC requires LP buyers to be qualified investors. I wasn't qualified when I bought some units. I think lots of businesses operate in this way. You need to talk to a local business lawyer. I think you could set this up pretty inexpensively.

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#307675 - 07/27/18 02:25 AM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 15512
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Most people didn't make good choices and don't have a million dollars.

blush **sheepishly raises hand** blush
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#307676 - 07/27/18 02:42 AM Re: Round Table For July 2018 [Re: pondering_it_all]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 9474
Loc: One of the Mexicos
I suppose many unsophisticated investors donít realize that the SEC requires new members in an unregistered LLC to be accredited.

The law is screwed up and needs to be changed to a more reasonable and rational set of conditions.
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