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#308561 - 09/18/18 03:56 AM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: NW Ponderer]
rporter314 Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 6525
Loc: Highlands, Tx
35% of Americans apparently strongly support Mr Trump regardless of anything he may have done. I wonder what percent of Americans strongly oppose him?
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty

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#308562 - 09/18/18 06:42 AM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: rporter314]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16229
Prosecution Exhibit #1: In stunning move, Trump declassifies documents related to Russia probe - NBC. Amendment 25 is absolutely justified. This is the result of the NYT Op-Ed. Trump did this publicly and without consultation to prevent intelligence folks from weighing in. He's also pissed about Kavanaugh's anointment being delayed. This will backfire on the midterms "Bigly".

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#308563 - 09/18/18 04:27 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: NW Ponderer]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 14268
Loc: Florida
Quote:
This will backfire on the midterms

We'll see. I think people's minds are pretty much already made up.
The only thing that will change the inevitable outcome of the November elections will be something that brings more voters to the polls.

I don't think this qualifies as that. It's just Trump being Trump...another day another headline.

But it seems every time he tries to cover his ass he just exposes it more.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

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#308564 - 09/18/18 06:17 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: NW Ponderer]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 7923
Loc: North San Diego County
He's in a hole and won't stop digging. But clearly this declassification move is treason. Revealing all the redacted parts of that FISA warrant to the world's intelligence services betrays American intelligence sources inside Russia, and will do unfixable damage to American intelligence operations. It will also probably get people killed.

This order demands immediate Amendment 25 action, because carrying it out would do such great damage to America. The Supreme Court story is insignificant in comparison. The media needs to stop being distracted and focus on the real story. This is the big moment that we all feared: That loose-cannon Trump would stumble onto something that is deadly.

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#308566 - 09/18/18 07:36 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline

Pooh-Bah

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 14268
Loc: Florida
meh...3000 died in Puerto Rico.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

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#308570 - 09/19/18 12:17 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: pondering_it_all]
Ma_Republican Offline
old hand

Registered: 02/12/04
Posts: 6505
Loc: USA
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
He's in a hole and won't stop digging. But clearly this declassification move is treason. Revealing all the redacted parts of that FISA warrant to the world's intelligence services betrays American intelligence sources inside Russia, and will do unfixable damage to American intelligence operations. It will also probably get people killed.

This order demands immediate Amendment 25 action, because carrying it out would do such great damage to America. The Supreme Court story is insignificant in comparison. The media needs to stop being distracted and focus on the real story. This is the big moment that we all feared: That loose-cannon Trump would stumble onto something that is deadly.


The whole FISA process should be abolished. If you look at how it has been manipulated by the FBI, you understand why the whole process is a joke. Trump has the ability to release the documents, he has the right to do so, and he gets to play politics at the same time. This is taking a page out of the Dems playbook.

I like it!

Tim
_________________________
A proud member of the Vast Right-wing Conspiracy, Massachusetts Chapter

“The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.”
Thomas Jefferson

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#308571 - 09/19/18 01:59 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: Ma_Republican]
Ujest Shurly Offline
newbie

Registered: 10/16/16
Posts: 356
Loc: Sterling Heights, MI, USA
Originally Posted By: Ma_Republican
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
He's in a hole and won't stop digging. But clearly this declassification move is treason. Revealing all the redacted parts of that FISA warrant to the world's intelligence services betrays American intelligence sources inside Russia, and will do unfixable damage to American intelligence operations. It will also probably get people killed.

This order demands immediate Amendment 25 action, because carrying it out would do such great damage to America. The Supreme Court story is insignificant in comparison. The media needs to stop being distracted and focus on the real story. This is the big moment that we all feared: That loose-cannon Trump would stumble onto something that is deadly.


The whole FISA process should be abolished. If you look at how it has been manipulated by the FBI, you understand why the whole process is a joke. Trump has the ability to release the documents, he has the right to do so, and he gets to play politics at the same time. This is taking a page out of the Dems playbook.

I like it!

Tim


"The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 ("FISA" Pub.L. 95–511, 92 Stat. 1783, 50 U.S.C. ch. 36) is a United States federal law which establishes procedures for the physical and electronic surveillance and collection of "foreign intelligence information" between "foreign powers" and "agents of foreign powers" suspected of espionage or terrorism.[1] The Act created the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) to oversee requests for surveillance warrants by federal law enforcement and intelligence agencies. It has been repeatedly amended since the September 11 attacks. "

From Wikipedia link Enacted by Democrats and dismembered by Republicans with the U.S.A Patriot Act and subsequent FISA amendments.

So if now Republicans say FISA is a Joke then they own the joke.

Nixon was pardoned AFTER he resigned. He resigned after members of the Republican Party went to him and told him, he would be impeached.

Spiro T. Agnew also resigned. "Beginning in early 1973, Agnew was investigated by the United States Attorney for the District of Maryland on suspicion of conspiracy, bribery, extortion and tax fraud. Agnew had accepted kickbacks from contractors during his time as Baltimore County executive and Governor of Maryland. The payments had continued into his time as vice president. On October 10, 1973, after months of maintaining his innocence, Agnew pleaded no contest to a single felony charge of tax evasion and resigned from office. He was replaced by House Minority Leader Gerald Ford."

Spiro Agnew

As President, President Donald (Traitor, Putin's biotch, Draft dodger, Capt. Bone spurs, Coward, and many more) Trump does have the authority to declassify anything. However, in the authority is also the responsibility to not expose any National Security Information, sources, methods, and also to protect Privacy Information. He has already demonstrated that he can not keep his anus of a mouth closed when it come to National Security information. He has already demonstrated that he does not understand that leaders do not privately meet with the enemy. He has already demonstrated that he does not care about the US by his refusal to do anything about proven Russian hacking and interference in the 2016 elections. Need I go on?

Congressional Republicans have already proven they are complicit in President Donald (Grab'em by the p***y) Trump's actions by failing to perform their sworn duty to their constituents, to the country and to the constitution.

My how republicans revise history to obfuscate their own failings.


edited to delete a comment that should not have been made.


Edited by Ujest Shurly (09/19/18 02:21 PM)
_________________________
Vote 2018; give meaning and honor to those who made sure you have the right to vote.

Life is like a PB&J sandwich
The older you get, the moldery and crustier you get.

Now, get off my grass!

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#308572 - 09/19/18 03:12 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: Ma_Republican]
rporter314 Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 6525
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
The whole FISA process should be abolished.
.
Open the discussion. I have no real opinion nor have I derived any firm conclusions. It is the law.

Quote:
If you look at how it has been manipulated by the FBI
OK stop right there.

Please document as best you can (from memory is ok) how the FBI has manipulated FISA .... remember don't make statements you pull out of your patoot unless you have the facts to support your claim. I am really interested in this as none of the ultra right wing nut jobs who support Mr Trump have made it clear to me how the FBI was at a minimum unethical in behavior and at worst criminal.

Please ... go ahead

Quote:
Trump has the ability to release the documents, he has the right to do so,
I don't think anyone has ever said any president doesn't have the right. That is something right wing folks make up to incite their base (worked with you).

What Dems are saying is by de-classifying the docs he may as well be a Russian spy in plain view. Why would Putin need to infiltrate American intelligence when he has Mr trump doing all the heavy lifting. Maybe you are a Russian plant. I don't know, but real Americans should find this very distasteful to say the least. Is Mr Trump selling out America or just giving it away?

Quote:
and he gets to play politics at the same time. This is taking a page out of the Dems playbook.
Please educate me what that means.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty

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#308574 - 09/19/18 07:28 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: rporter314]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16229
I find it fascinating that Republicans, the ersatz "law and order" party, are now so anti law and order. The truth is, the party has never been into law and order, just into controlling the opposition - whether that be uppity blacks, non-whites of nearly any shade, Democrats, "pinkos", voters, whatever - through any means at disposal. Sometimes they use lawfare (manipulating legal processes to achieve political aims, such as voter suppression, highjacking court appointments, and gerrymandering), but as often it is just purely illegal means (as courts have frequently ruled - see, e.g., "Bridgegate").

So, it is not really surprising that they would adopt anti-law positions when legal process is inconvenient (like vetting Supreme Court nominees, or following warrant application processes, or due process). It's just illuminating that they do it out in the open. Trump is trying to out-Nixon Nixon in the sheer criminality department.

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#308575 - 09/19/18 08:00 PM Re: The United States v Donald Trump [Re: NW Ponderer]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2129
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
NWP
I agree with everything you said. The dems can claim to be the law and order party with a lot more justification. They can also claim to be the party of fiscal responsibility too. I just wish the Dems would call the Republicans on these sorts of claims as they are certainly vulnerable making such claims.

The Jackass, of course, when running, claimed to be "The Master of Debt". If you read some of the accounts of his business practices, and outstanding suits against him, it would seem that his solution to debt is to simply ignore and not pay any of his bills.

The Dems don't seem to want to mention any of this stuff - strange...........

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