Current Topics
Where have all the conservatives gone?
by rporter314
0 seconds ago
The Impeachment of Donald trump
by rporter314
11 minutes 34 seconds ago
Never-Before-Seen Trump Tax Documents Show Major Inconsistencies
by pondering_it_all
28 minutes 56 seconds ago
What is "old"?
by pondering_it_all
33 minutes 30 seconds ago
RoundTable for Fall 2019
by pondering_it_all
Today at 01:13 AM
Hyper-partisanship and irrationality
by logtroll
Today at 12:47 AM
auto industry, unions and strikes
by Jeffery J. Haas
Yesterday at 11:14 PM
If ISIS does the unthinkable...
by chunkstyle
Yesterday at 01:09 PM
Are both "sides" equally corrupt?
by chunkstyle
Yesterday at 12:18 PM
The Trump/Biden/Ukraine thing
by chunkstyle
Yesterday at 01:29 AM
The Departed - 2019
by pdx rick
10/17/19 01:12 PM
Why do humans fight so much?
by Greger
10/15/19 02:13 PM
Global warming predictions
by logtroll
10/13/19 08:47 PM
Turkey's Erdogan threatens to release millions of refugees into Europe over crit
by pdx rick
10/12/19 07:35 PM
Partisans' Trust in Legislative Branch Has Shifted in Past Year
by perotista
10/11/19 03:37 AM
Trump unleashes ISIS in Kurd Country
by Greger
10/10/19 05:31 PM
SF Board of Supervisors declare NRA a domestic terrorist organization
by NW Ponderer
10/09/19 03:08 PM
Is it too soon to be talking 2020?
by chunkstyle
10/07/19 02:44 PM
NRA acted as "foreign asset" for Russia ahead of 2016 election, Senate report cl
by Greger
10/07/19 02:19 AM
Roe v. Wade Is Under Immediate Threat
by jgw
10/06/19 08:05 PM
Forum Stats
6282 Members
59 Forums
16713 Topics
290886 Posts

Max Online: 294 @ 12/06/17 12:57 AM
Google Adsense
Page 43 of 44 < 1 2 ... 41 42 43 44 >
Topic Options
#315147 - 09/10/19 06:36 AM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Senator Hatrack]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 17102
I REALLY WISH Senator, that you wouldn't persist in pursuing error so strenuously. It's almost as bad as Trump's Alabama hurricane obsession. I won't belabor it. You've embarrassed yourself enough already. I provided statutes, citations, explicit reality, and you reply with talking points and anecdotes.

Top
#315154 - 09/10/19 03:27 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Senator Hatrack]
Greger Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 15480
Loc: Florida
Quote:
I stated the fact that what you call "cages" were built during the Obama administration. The pictures of kids in "cages" that has ideological blind liberals, like you, so bent out of shape were taken in 2014. Who was our President in 2014? Here is a clue, which you will overlook, it was NOT Trump!


Quote:
When members of Congress reached a bipartisan deal to end the government shutdown in February, they gave Immigration and Customs Enforcement a simple instruction: Stop detaining so many people. Instead, ICE pushed its detention population to an all-time high of 54,000 people, up from about 34,000 on an average day in 2016 and well above the 40,520 target Congress set for ICE.

Now, just after Congress rejected another request for more detention money, ICE is continuing to spend money it hasn’t been given. Mother Jones has learned that ICE has started using three new for-profit immigration detention centers in the Deep South in recent weeks.
Three new FOR PROFIT dentention centers!

Yeah, well...Who's grip on reality seems to be slipping here?
Beyond that it makes no difference to me which Party supports detention of non-criminal immigrants and refugees. It's cruel, wrong and counterproductive. It's a matter of paperwork. Or it's a matter of racist xenophobia. It's not a matter of everyone and anyone who breaks the law belongs in a cage. Authoritarians just really like people in cages!
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

Top
#315155 - 09/10/19 04:24 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: NW Ponderer]
Senator Hatrack Offline
member

Registered: 08/14/07
Posts: 1600
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
I REALLY WISH Senator, that you wouldn't persist in pursuing error so strenuously. It's almost as bad as Trump's Alabama hurricane obsession. I won't belabor it. You've embarrassed yourself enough already. I provided statutes, citations, explicit reality, and you reply with talking points and anecdotes.

You quoted a small section of the law, without posting a link to the entire law, in an attempt to prove your claim. You have not proved that you are right but you have, as you quite often do, again pompously insisted that you are right.
_________________________
The state can never straighten the crooked timber of humanity.
I'm a conservative because I question authority.
Conservative Revolutionary

Top
#315157 - 09/10/19 04:32 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Greger]
Senator Hatrack Offline
member

Registered: 08/14/07
Posts: 1600
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
I stated the fact that what you call "cages" were built during the Obama administration. The pictures of kids in "cages" that has ideological blind liberals, like you, so bent out of shape were taken in 2014. Who was our President in 2014? Here is a clue, which you will overlook, it was NOT Trump!


Quote:
When members of Congress reached a bipartisan deal to end the government shutdown in February, they gave Immigration and Customs Enforcement a simple instruction: Stop detaining so many people. Instead, ICE pushed its detention population to an all-time high of 54,000 people, up from about 34,000 on an average day in 2016 and well above the 40,520 target Congress set for ICE.

Now, just after Congress rejected another request for more detention money, ICE is continuing to spend money it hasn’t been given. Mother Jones has learned that ICE has started using three new for-profit immigration detention centers in the Deep South in recent weeks.
Three new FOR PROFIT dentention centers!

Yeah, well...Who's grip on reality seems to be slipping here?
Beyond that it makes no difference to me which Party supports detention of non-criminal immigrants and refugees. It's cruel, wrong and counterproductive. It's a matter of paperwork. Or it's a matter of racist xenophobia. It's not a matter of everyone and anyone who breaks the law belongs in a cage. Authoritarians just really like people in cages!

Where are these people, of which there is a large number, to be kept, in a hotel? With a large number of people coming to our border doing the paperwork takes time. These people are being detained while the paper work is being done, hence the detention centers.
_________________________
The state can never straighten the crooked timber of humanity.
I'm a conservative because I question authority.
Conservative Revolutionary

Top
#315159 - 09/10/19 05:41 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Senator Hatrack]
Greger Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 15480
Loc: Florida

Where are they to be kept? That's the beauty of it Senator...They don't need to be "kept". And hotels are a lot cheaper than detention centers.

They need to be processed and sent on their way. Photos and fingerprints taken. Identities verified whenever possible and background checks done. Issue them photo IDs that will serve also as balance transfer cards so that employers can pay them through the immigration system, the cards will also track them wherever they go and automatically collect taxes for fees and services.

A matter of minutes in most cases days in others. Hire people to process them rather than people to terrorize them.

Think of these people as volunteers who have come here to make America great again!
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

Top
#315160 - 09/10/19 05:48 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Greger]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline

It's the Despair Quotient!
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 14319
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Greger
Think of these people as volunteers who have come here to make America great again!


He can't. He is sure that they would vote Democrat, which of course makes them communists.
Oh wait, sorry...MARXISTS.
_________________________
The only people pushing the Athenian Straw Man Nonexistent Threat of Slippery Slope Windyfoggery (ASMNSSW) RE DEMOCRACY are people who have a misunderstanding/problem or hatred of democracy. (See AUTHORITARIANS)

Top
#315168 - 09/10/19 06:29 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Greger]
Senator Hatrack Offline
member

Registered: 08/14/07
Posts: 1600
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: Greger

Where are they to be kept? That's the beauty of it Senator...They don't need to be "kept". And hotels are a lot cheaper than detention centers.

They need to be processed and sent on their way. Photos and fingerprints taken. Identities verified whenever possible and background checks done. Issue them photo IDs that will serve also as balance transfer cards so that employers can pay them through the immigration system, the cards will also track them wherever they go and automatically collect taxes for fees and services.

A matter of minutes in most cases days in others. Hire people to process them rather than people to terrorize them.

Think of these people as volunteers who have come here to make America great again!

What f__king lala land do you live in? There are between 30 to 50,000 people in the detention centers. To process that many people takes months, not days. Just the fingerprinting of that many people will take months. Then to do a background check will take even more time. Thank you showing beyond any doubt that you have completely lost your grip on reality!
_________________________
The state can never straighten the crooked timber of humanity.
I'm a conservative because I question authority.
Conservative Revolutionary

Top
#315169 - 09/10/19 06:33 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Senator Hatrack Offline
member

Registered: 08/14/07
Posts: 1600
Loc: MN
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: Greger
Think of these people as volunteers who have come here to make America great again!


He can't. He is sure that they would vote Democrat, which of course makes them communists.
Oh wait, sorry...MARXISTS.

That you believe that all of my comments say that all Democrats are Marxists is only in your head.
_________________________
The state can never straighten the crooked timber of humanity.
I'm a conservative because I question authority.
Conservative Revolutionary

Top
#315180 - 09/10/19 10:21 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: Senator Hatrack]
Greger Offline

Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 15480
Loc: Florida
They don't really need fingerprints theses days. Just a DNA sample will do. I understand there's a backlog, Senator, and that these things take time. But we've had years to streamline the system and have chosen instead to throw up roadblocks.

My point is that these folks aren't criminals and don't need to be treated as such. And I get your point that some of them might be, but those guys gonna slip the border at night, not apply for refuge or seek employment here.

Just regular folks trying to survive. Why make it harder than it has to be?

Same goes for regular folks all across America. They're working their butts off and can't make enough to get by. And government, rather than streamline things so everybody gets enough to get by, throws up roadblocks.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."— Oscar Wilde

Top
#315189 - 09/11/19 01:42 PM Re: The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? [Re: NW Ponderer]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 9462
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: NW Ponderer
The Debate: Is America’s future capitalist or socialist? (Vox). Again, a lengthy, but readable, discussion of a big idea. It's really the difference between Ocasio-Cortez' and Elizabeth Warren's visions of liberalism.

We've had several threads about new economic thinking and how broken capitalism is. This encapsulates many of them.

Here is an interesting article on a variant of socialism (not Socialism) - the commons.

Quote:
...we documented dozens of notable commons, suggesting that the actual scope and impact of commoning in today’s world is quite large. Our capacity to self-organize to address needs, independent of the state or market, can be seen in community forests, cooperatively run farms and fisheries, open source design and manufacturing communities with global reach, local and regional currencies, and myriad other examples in all realms of life. The elemental human impulse that we are born with — to help others, to improve existing practices — ripens into a stable social form with countless variations: a commons.
_________________________
You can’t solve a problem without first understanding what the problem is.

Top
Page 43 of 44 < 1 2 ... 41 42 43 44 >

Who's Online
0 registered (), 13 Guests and 2 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Snarky_Politics, Moot, Ikari, perotista, ttwtt78640
6282 Registered Users
A2