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#312916 - 07/16/19 05:44 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17271
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Trump has smartly kept his voters foaming and howling for 3 yrs now. He can count on that base of support to show up.


That's 42% of the voters best as I can tell, can you win an election with that?
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#312917 - 07/16/19 06:40 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: chunkstyle
Not that it matters but I believe the Democratic party is incapable of transforming public opinion into political support as effectively a Republican do.


Then you understand after all!
I've said MANY times that Republicans work like an ARMY while Democrats act like a bunch of hissing kittens and hand-wringing purity ponies over minutae.

It's like watching a flock of meadowlarks trying to beat up a monitor lizard with a bouquet of tulips.

If we are up against a machine like that and forced to play on a tilted playing field (gerrymandering and vote suppression) then it is clear we have to look at overall mass electability first, just to get a foothold back.

It is NOT HOW elections should work and I am the first to agree with you on that but it's the reality right here and right now.
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#312919 - 07/16/19 07:53 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: Greger]
chunkstyle Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 2356
Yes.
It's already happened.
The Democratic machine ran a candidate that had low voter approval. It didn't help having the outright corruption of the parties nominating process laid bare in a time of anti-establishment anger.

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#312920 - 07/16/19 08:07 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
chunkstyle Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 2356
Mobilize your base with proposals that have broad popular support, directly addressing people's material concern.

Corbyn did it in the U.K. Obrador did it in Mexico.

My question to you, Jeff, is why the Democratic party won't?

We saw how 2016 went down. The fact that I keep hearing 'anyone but Trump' from libs tells me the party is not going to in 2020 either.

The latest punching left by Pelosi and now Trump confirm the parties position of having no vision of transformational change for mobilizing the base and, just as important, increasing it.

I think they're going to try and pick up a rebound off of Trump, just as they'd hoped in 2016.





Edited by chunkstyle (07/16/19 08:21 PM)

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#312922 - 07/16/19 08:28 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
chunkstyle Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 2356
A timely article from a lefty mag is describing another fascinating race shaping up in W.Virginia.

The reason I'm fascinated by W.Virginia are it's labor history and politics. Another is the deafening silence for any political examination in how the Democratic party has so alienated itself from voters who were solidly blue. For me V.Virginia represents a broader dynamic going on in the Democratic party between genuine progressives and inclusive populists pitted against the corporate wing. Between the Steve Smiths and the Joe Manchins, Sanders vs Clinton, etc..:

"A contest between Manchin and Smith will draw a line in the sand, forcing those interests that have traditionally adhered to the state Democratic Party’s coalition to decide whether they believe in a party that continues to be dominated by corporate interests or one that seeks to build a genuine popular movement to benefit working people."


Full article



Edited by chunkstyle (07/16/19 08:30 PM)

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#312928 - 07/17/19 06:22 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10345
Loc: North San Diego County
Very impressive article about Elizabeth Warren. She's all about policies and her policy ideas come from the think tank in her Senate office and a network of the best and brightest we have in America. I think she might be the most competent President we've ever had!

This Was Elizabeth Warren’s Plan All Along

The bottom line is that everything comes down to income inequality.

Quote:
“It looks like we’re trying to solve a lot of different problems, but we’re only trying to solve one problem,” said Jon Donenberg, who is now the policy director for Warren’s presidential campaign. “It’s the rigged system; it’s the corrupt government and economy that only benefits those at the top. Every solution flows from that.”

Almost Robert Reich verbatim. And I loved this quote:

Quote:
When all the research is complete and the policies appear done, Warren has one final task. It must be possible to explain every policy that comes out of her office in practical language to anyone.

She asks staffers to consider, “How can I tell the story about this that people will understand?” according to Levitin.

When she ran the Congressional Oversight Panel, every 100-page report her office put out first went to her desk, where she would write a one-page plain-language explanation for the press and the public.

“Her unusual strength is being able to translate really complex problems into a way that an ordinary person can understand them,” Levitin said.

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#312931 - 07/17/19 11:22 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17271
Loc: Florida
Quote:
The bottom line is that everything comes down to income inequality.


Hammer, meet nail.
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#312932 - 07/18/19 02:31 AM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
chunkstyle Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 2356
She'll get the Lanyard Liberal vote. She's got them policies.
I don't think she'll be transformative though.
She wouldn't be a disaster as much as we've seen. I think she believes she can tame capitalism.


Edited by chunkstyle (07/18/19 02:34 AM)

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#312933 - 07/18/19 05:22 AM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: chunkstyle]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10345
Loc: North San Diego County
I'm surprised you don't have more complaints about her, considering her role in bailing out the banks in 2009. But no matter: She would be the most competent President ever, but she won't get elected. The thing I learned in 2016 is that women don't trust other women. There's just some deep misogyny in most women. I suppose it has something to do with competition.

But she would make a great VP to some pretty boy with credentials, like George Cloony. Between Amal for foreign policy advice and Elizabeth for domestic, he could be great. A liberal's Ronald Reagan. Since we have amply demonstrated that any rich celebrity can be elected, I think George is a shoe-in. He has 1000 times Trump's CV.

And it would be funny to see all those Trump supporter's wives vote for George because he's hot.
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#312939 - 07/18/19 06:41 PM Re: Is it too soon to be talking 2020? [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17271
Loc: Florida
Clooney might be a liberal wet dream, but he aint in the race. I'll go this far though...if we have to have Biden as the nominee maybe he'll pick Warren to run with him....
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