Current Topics
Is it too soon to be talking 2020?
by rporter314
1 second ago
Do both sides really do it?
by logtroll
Today at 01:38 PM
Portland. A Turning Point?
by pdx rick
Today at 12:22 PM
Bloomberg raises $16M to pay fines of 32K former felons so they can vote
by pdx rick
Today at 12:17 PM
Ruth Bader Ginsburg Has Died
by rporter314
Today at 01:33 AM
The Republican Platform
by pondering_it_all
Yesterday at 09:22 PM
Global warming predictions
by pondering_it_all
09/20/20 09:04 PM
RoundTable for Summer 2020
by jgw
09/20/20 04:47 PM
Half of troops have an unfavorable opinion of President Bone Spurs
by CPWILL
09/20/20 07:42 AM
West Coast Burning
by NW Ponderer
09/19/20 06:57 PM
Bob Woodward's book details Trump's chaotic and dysfunctional White House
by Greger
09/19/20 06:57 PM
Coronavirus: The Plague of The 21st Century?
by pondering_it_all
09/18/20 05:18 AM
The Boogaloo Bois
by pondering_it_all
09/17/20 08:17 AM
How the world sees U.S. and Trump
by jgw
09/16/20 09:01 PM
The Trump campaign is broke
by pdx rick
09/15/20 12:20 PM
Barr is acting as ‘personal henchman’ of Trump
by Greger
09/13/20 09:33 PM
Covid Long Haulers
by jgw
09/07/20 06:23 PM
A post, on facebook, by my granddaughter that covers it all pretty good!
by pondering_it_all
09/02/20 07:27 PM
The Democratic Fight
by jgw
09/02/20 06:09 PM
voters who don't
by pondering_it_all
09/01/20 08:35 AM
Forum Stats
6292 Members
60 Forums
16996 Topics
302900 Posts

Max Online: 294 @ 12/06/17 12:57 AM
Google Adsense
Page 17 of 17 < 1 2 ... 15 16 17
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#324956 - 04/29/20 12:47 AM Re: College debt [Re: logtroll]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17282
Loc: Florida
I figgered the only way to win was to die owing them money.

Then bankruptcy made sure I'd never owe another man a penny.

I lost.

But I'm okay with that. I'm happy with the way things worked out for me. I live by the Rede and the Threefold Law and there is more to life than money. I'm blessed in more ways than I can count.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

Top
#324961 - 04/29/20 03:17 AM Re: College debt [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 451
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
"Fairness" is getting precisely what you earn, and nothing more or less. I, think, perhaps, what you are advocating for is Economic Mercy.


And you may say what you will about the current system "mercy" is not a part of it. Our federal government has determined that an hour of a man's time is worth $7.25. Merciless to say the least.


The federal government has determined that an hour of a man's time is worth $7.25. There are men (and women) who earn $10, $20, $40, $100 an hour and more. Had the government determined that an hour of their time was worth $7.25 and mandated that, none of that would exist.

Instead what has happened is that the government has declared that if someone's labor does not provide more than $7.25 an hour plus the cost of taxes plus administration costs, you are not legally allowed to hire that person, and must therefore leave them in unemployment.

As for "Mercy" however, for that man or women who does make $7.25 an hour, the federal government provides healthcare, food assistance, a wage boost, etc. so on and so forth. The structure of many of these programs is often destructive - not least because it punishes wise decisions - but they are absolutely in place motivated by mercy.

And that's fine. I think we should have mercy. But it's not "fairness". Fairness would be you get what you earn, and nothing else. Strict Justice is Without Mercy.

Quote:
Fairness on the other hand is a living wage.


No. You are confusing "something I would like" with "something that is fair", and a "living wage" is something that will vary wildly from place to place and individual to individual. What a 16 year old needs to survive while living with his parents but wanting to pick up gasoline money during summer vacation in rural Ohio is very different than what a 30 year old with a wife and two babies needs to get by in the same place, and wildly different from the latter's counterpart in San Diego.

Quote:
Else we might as well call them slaves and be done with it. Then anything short of flogging the skin from their backs is perfectly fair and mercy is up to the Boss Man.


I've worked for less than $7.25 an hour. Don't recall getting whipped smile


Edited by CPWILL (04/29/20 03:20 AM)
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

Top
#324962 - 04/29/20 03:25 AM Re: College debt [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 451
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL


I'm not sure, however, that economic "fairness" is really what you're advocating for, there. "Fairness" is getting precisely what you earn, and nothing more or less. I, think, perhaps, what you are advocating for is Economic Mercy.


Not sure what "fairness" has to do with it.


It was the value he raised. Personally, I think we can afford Mercy, and probably should, to the extent that we can do so without doing Harm.

Quote:
What makes the economy function best? Because the current model is crap.


As near as we can tell, what makes the economy function best is a predictable and consistent but light regulatory environment, strong institutions that militate against extractive politically connected interest groups, low debt burdens, low tax burdens, an educated populace, good infrastructure, the ability to access a wide variety of markets, etc. so on and so forth. The current model has many problems, but is still producing the best living standards ever reached in the history of the human species.
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

Top
#324963 - 04/29/20 03:26 AM Re: College debt [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 451
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
Is she willing to take any advice or follow-on help?


Of course not.


Damn. I have a strong-willed daughter, and was hoping the Daddy-Connection stuck around after the teen years were over :-/

Quote:
But she's smart and a hard worker so she'll be okay. I worked for sh*t wages all my life and managed to survive so she will too.


I sincerely hope she does well.
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

Top
#324969 - 04/29/20 03:52 PM Re: College debt [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL


I'm not sure, however, that economic "fairness" is really what you're advocating for, there. "Fairness" is getting precisely what you earn, and nothing more or less. I, think, perhaps, what you are advocating for is Economic Mercy.


Not sure what "fairness" has to do with it.


It was the value he raised. Personally, I think we can afford Mercy, and probably should, to the extent that we can do so without doing Harm.

Quote:
What makes the economy function best? Because the current model is crap.


As near as we can tell, what makes the economy function best is a predictable and consistent but light regulatory environment, strong institutions that militate against extractive politically connected interest groups, low debt burdens, low tax burdens, an educated populace, good infrastructure, the ability to access a wide variety of markets, etc. so on and so forth. The current model has many problems, but is still producing the best living standards ever reached in the history of the human species.


I can put nitrous oxide in my engine, and I will go fast. For a while.

This doesn't mean that it's the best way to run my engine.

Likewise, 200 years of boom and bust is not the best way to run an economy.
_________________________
What can we do to help you stop screaming?

Top
#324978 - 04/29/20 07:46 PM Re: College debt [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 451
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL


I'm not sure, however, that economic "fairness" is really what you're advocating for, there. "Fairness" is getting precisely what you earn, and nothing more or less. I, think, perhaps, what you are advocating for is Economic Mercy.


Not sure what "fairness" has to do with it.


It was the value he raised. Personally, I think we can afford Mercy, and probably should, to the extent that we can do so without doing Harm.

Quote:
What makes the economy function best? Because the current model is crap.


As near as we can tell, what makes the economy function best is a predictable and consistent but light regulatory environment, strong institutions that militate against extractive politically connected interest groups, low debt burdens, low tax burdens, an educated populace, good infrastructure, the ability to access a wide variety of markets, etc. so on and so forth. The current model has many problems, but is still producing the best living standards ever reached in the history of the human species.


I can put nitrous oxide in my engine, and I will go fast. For a while.

This doesn't mean that it's the best way to run my engine.

Likewise, 200 years of boom and bust is not the best way to run an economy.


Hm. Alright. If the last 200 years of freeish enterprise and Liberal (classically understood) Government have been so dangerous and terrible, what 200 year period in human history do you believe we were better off in?


Edited by CPWILL (04/29/20 07:47 PM)
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

Top
#324987 - 04/30/20 12:29 AM Re: College debt [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17282
Loc: Florida
With a little luck, the next 200 years.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

Top
#324988 - 04/30/20 02:34 AM Re: College debt [Re: Hamish Howl]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl

I can put nitrous oxide in my engine, and I will go fast. For a while.

This doesn't mean that it's the best way to run my engine.

Likewise, 200 years of boom and bust is not the best way to run an economy.


You can even put napthalene in there.
Of course, in about fifty miles your mufflers will have holes in them, and in another 150-200 miles so will your pistons.
_________________________
"The Best of the Leon Russell Festivals" DVD
deepfreezefilms.com

Top
#325099 - 05/03/20 03:59 PM Re: College debt [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 451
Originally Posted By: Greger
With a little luck, the next 200 years.


smile Hopefully. I suspect, however, that will require that we not chuck everything we've (painfully) learned about good limited human governance over the past 3,000 years.
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

Top
Page 17 of 17 < 1 2 ... 15 16 17

Who's Online
1 registered (rporter314), 37 Guests and 1 Spider online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Superfly, GreatNewsTonight, danarhea, RoughDraft274, CPWILL
6292 Registered Users
A2