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#315387 - 09/15/19 02:12 PM Government. What is it and why do we need it?
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10148
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Kind of a fundamental question - the answer will serve to color any discussion of various types of government and their scope.

Apparently, humans have some difficulties communicating and coexisting peacefully, and need some managing structure with rules and enforcement.

Are there any examples of societies that get along okay without a government?
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#315388 - 09/15/19 02:14 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
NW Ponderer Offline
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Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 17387
Log, my friend, you have a bad habit of posting something germane to something I was just about to post. Let me finish that and I'll bring it here.

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#315390 - 09/15/19 02:26 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: NW Ponderer]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
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Interesting that you have still not found the surveillance cameras. eek2
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#315391 - 09/15/19 02:30 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10148
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Theme song of the Classical Liberal laissez faire-e:

Government.
HUH!
Good Gawd, yaw..
What is it good for?
Absolutely nuttin'!
Say it again...

Is there an instance of such a society that we can examine and learn from?
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#315392 - 09/15/19 02:49 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10148
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Think of this... a private company, the beacon of Capitalism, yearning for freedom from government interference, also has a governing structure. I daresay most frequently that form of government is a dictatorship. Or, in the case of a corporation, it is similar to authoritarian Socialism.

CRAZY!!! tonbricks
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#315394 - 09/15/19 02:56 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
NW Ponderer Offline
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Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 17387
The Conditions of Our Lives.

We and our government are controlled by conditions. Must, Must not, May, Should, Shouldn't, Can, Can't. These can be categorized as Legal, Moral/Ethical, and Practical conditions. (I may, pole vault, but I can't, and therefore, shouldn't.) They can also be categorized as Requisite, Prohibitive, Permissive, or Conditional. (I have a vague memory of discussing this in a philosophy class sometime.) [This discussion is extremely relevant to another thread, too.] Sometimes, unfortunately, we use language that conveys multiple meanings or confuses these conditions (e.g., referring to "unauthorized aliens" as "illegals").

Our Constitution is one of the seminal exemplars of these kinds of conditions. Below that are statutes, regulations, and codes. I'll elaborate, later, but I wanted to get the concepts in the discussion.

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#315421 - 09/15/19 08:51 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
chunkstyle Offline
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Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 2356
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Or, in the case of a corporation, it is similar to authoritarian Socialism.

CRAZY!!! tonbricks


Howzat?

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#315424 - 09/15/19 09:20 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: chunkstyle]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10148
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Shareholders who are technically members but who have little or no control; a small group of leaders with absolute control (the Board); and wage workers who do what they are told.
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#315525 - 09/17/19 06:09 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: logtroll]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16842
Loc: Florida
It's a stretch Loggy. But I didn't want this thread to die so quickly.

To me the US Government is the national piggybank. It is where we hoard our resources and cash just in case we need them someday. It is their job to levy taxes and allocate funds to keep things running smoothly.
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Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#315528 - 09/17/19 06:23 PM Re: Government. What is it and why do we need it? [Re: Greger]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10148
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Sure, it’s a stretch - one meant to stretch the grey matter a bit. The one being that Capitalism ain’t Democracy.
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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