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#317003 - 10/20/19 09:56 PM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: logtroll]
chunkstyle Offline
member

Registered: 10/02/07
Posts: 1935
I think it was King who said you canít have social justice without economic justice. Liberals tend to ignore the latter and focus on the former. Or at least thatís been my observations since the eighties.

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#317005 - 10/20/19 11:03 PM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8951
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
Be kind and open to people who look different, or who come from other cultures and racial backgrounds. Be generous and share with the less fortunate, be a good steward of our Earth. Be real about equality with women and the gay community. Be willing to pursue diplomacy rather than militaristic solutions to all issues.


Very Sermon-On-The-Mount! Seems like the struggle between left and right is very informed by Matthew 25. All of these so-called Christians on the right should read it again, and see what Jesus had to say about getting into heaven.

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#317006 - 10/20/19 11:16 PM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: logtroll]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8951
Loc: North San Diego County
A lot of this "far" labeling is really because of how we feel about the person of interest. Humans almost always feel first, and then construct a justification for their feelings. Easy example: The way Trump felt about Obama was obvious right from Obama's first campaign effort. So he had to construct all sorts of reasons why everything connected with Obama is evil and everything Obama did must be undone. ACA is almost exactly RomneyCare, but since Obama signed it (not wrote it!) it must be bad. Even if many of the ideas in it were from The Heritage Foundation.

Same thing with antifa: Those communist connotations probably come from Germany, where communism and anarchism is more popular. In the US, most antifa are just anti fascist: In the same sense that US patriots and soldiers were in WW II! They want all the fascists to go crawl back under the rocks they came out from. I am actually anti-fascist, and I bet most of you are too.

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#317007 - 10/21/19 12:19 AM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: pondering_it_all]
perotista Offline
newbie

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 233
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
A lot of this "far" labeling is really because of how we feel about the person of interest. Humans almost always feel first, and then construct a justification for their feelings. Easy example: The way Trump felt about Obama was obvious right from Obama's first campaign effort. So he had to construct all sorts of reasons why everything connected with Obama is evil and everything Obama did must be undone. ACA is almost exactly RomneyCare, but since Obama signed it (not wrote it!) it must be bad. Even if many of the ideas in it were from The Heritage Foundation.

Same thing with antifa: Those communist connotations probably come from Germany, where communism and anarchism is more popular. In the US, most antifa are just anti fascist: In the same sense that US patriots and soldiers were in WW II! They want all the fascists to go crawl back under the rocks they came out from. I am actually anti-fascist, and I bet most of you are too.


There was one big difference, the majority of the people of Massachusetts were in favor of Romneycare. The majority of all Americans opposed Obamacare. That in itself made it an easy target for the GOP take over of the house in 2010.

Romneycare was probably a good thing for Obama, Romneycare basically stop Romney from using Obamacare as a campaign issue in 2012. Of course Obama was more liked and had a higher favorable rating than Romney by Americans as a whole. Whether or not one agreed with Obama's policies he was a likable man. At least in my view.

I never voted for Obama, but thought he was a good president. I voted for McCain than third party in 2012. I never trusted Romney as he changed his stripes, his political views to run for the presidency as a Republican. Just like Trump has done. Another big difference there though, is Trump has switched parties eight times to Romney's none.

Labeling someone far left or far right is a personal perspective. How the one doing the labeling feels or thinks about the individual he is labeling. It's also a regional one as I pointed out earlier.

There's no doubt folks from the Northeast and West Coast are a heck of a lot more liberal than those from the south, midwest and plain states. They view someone more mainstream or center to center left politically while someone from the south, midwest and plain states would view them far left. Generally I mean, on average. The reverse is true also as to far right.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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#317019 - 10/21/19 03:43 PM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: perotista]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 15781
Loc: Florida
Quote:
I voted for McCain


McCain and that lady From Alaska whose name I will not type. Odd choice for someone who claims to be a Centrist. He mighta somehow been labeled a "Maverick" but she was about as hard right as anybody on the planet.

The far right was behind them all the way. And so were you.

Oddly Romney is a centrist. But you didn't trust him because he was a radical centrist I guess? Liable to move a tiny bit in either direction when you want government to remain absolutely neutral on all subjects except for funding endless war.

I really don't care who you vote for or why or whether you vote at all, that's your choice and none of my business. But you keep siding with the hard right, demonizing most Democrats, voting hard right and claiming somehow to be a Centrist.

I just don't see it.
_________________________
"Be yourself; everyone else is already taken."ó Oscar Wilde

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#317027 - 10/21/19 09:58 PM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: Greger]
perotista Offline
newbie

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 233
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
I voted for McCain


McCain and that lady From Alaska whose name I will not type. Odd choice for someone who claims to be a Centrist. He mighta somehow been labeled a "Maverick" but she was about as hard right as anybody on the planet.

The far right was behind them all the way. And so were you.

Oddly Romney is a centrist. But you didn't trust him because he was a radical centrist I guess? Liable to move a tiny bit in either direction when you want government to remain absolutely neutral on all subjects except for funding endless war.

I really don't care who you vote for or why or whether you vote at all, that's your choice and none of my business. But you keep siding with the hard right, demonizing most Democrats, voting hard right and claiming somehow to be a Centrist.

I just don't see it.



It's all a matter of personal perspectives. I never considered McCain to be far right, I didn't consider Obama to be far left. Center right and center left, sure. I like McCain because he didn't always put his political party first and foremost above country as almost all other politicians and elected officials do.

I never claimed to be a centrist, depending on the issue I'll back the democrats sometimes, I'll back the GOP other times, but on quite a lot of issues, I just don't give an owls hoot.

If you want to label me as a hard core rightist, I'm fine with that. There is another site I've been labeled both hard core rightist and a hard core leftist. I suppose that depends on the issue.

What I am is a swing voter, centrist or moderate are words that I don't consider myself. I suppose just because I dislike Warren and consider a far leftist, that makes me a far rightist. So be it.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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#317031 - 10/22/19 03:09 AM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: pondering_it_all]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline

It's the Despair Quotient!
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 14608
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all

Same thing with antifa: Those communist connotations probably come from Germany, where communism and anarchism is more popular. In the US, most antifa are just anti fascist: In the same sense that US patriots and soldiers were in WW II!


We differ here.
"In the same sense that most US patriots and soldiers were in WWII?"
I'm sorry.

I.
Just.
Can't.

Antifa are mostly about the street theater just like their equally deranged counterparts on the right.
All of it is strictly for public display.
Unlike...so very unlike, our men and women in uniform and our patriots, Antifa and the swastika boys have accomplished exactly nothing for all their efforts, except to spread nonsense.

Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all

They want all the fascists to go crawl back under the rocks they came out from. I am actually anti-fascist, and I bet most of you are too.


Of course, but I won't ever don the black costume to go fight idiots in the streets. If they ever show up at my work, my home, in my neighborhood or around my family, that's when I'll fight, and for protection, not for public display.
_________________________
The only people pushing the Athenian Straw Man Nonexistent Threat of Slippery Slope Windyfoggery (ASMNSSW) RE DEMOCRACY are people who have a misunderstanding/problem or hatred of democracy. (See AUTHORITARIANS)

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#317032 - 10/22/19 03:16 AM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: perotista]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline

It's the Despair Quotient!
Pooh-Bah

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 14608
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: perotista


There was one big difference, the majority of the people of Massachusetts were in favor of Romneycare. The majority of all Americans opposed Obamacare. That in itself made it an easy target for the GOP take over of the house in 2010.


And yet when polled about the positions and goals set forth in "The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act" it turns out that a VERY WIDE MAJORITY of Americans very much LIKE "Obamacare".
(Pssstt!!! Just don't call it OBAMACARE)

That's because, apparently ONE THIRD of Americans don't even realize that Obamacare and the ACA are the same thing!

I think we might have found where the anti-Obamacare majority lies.
wink
_________________________
The only people pushing the Athenian Straw Man Nonexistent Threat of Slippery Slope Windyfoggery (ASMNSSW) RE DEMOCRACY are people who have a misunderstanding/problem or hatred of democracy. (See AUTHORITARIANS)

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#317033 - 10/22/19 03:18 AM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: logtroll]
perotista Offline
newbie

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 233
Considering far left and far right, what about the political ideology of both major parties? YouGov asked about the ideology, not whether either was far right or far left, it was whether the Democrats were too liberal, just about right or not liberal enough. The same question was asked about the Republican Party, too conservative, just about right or not conservative enough. I realize some of you say they arenít interested in polls, thatís okay. I just thought I would share this anyway for anyone who is interested.

Nationwide, all Americans were asked. You can take a gander at how both parties and independents broke down, by gender, race, age, geographical regions and more by viewing the questions in the link. Question 64. Democratic Party Ideology - Is the Democratic Party...
All Adults, Too Liberal 41%, About right 26%, not liberal enough 12%, not sure 21%

Question 65. Republican Party Ideology - Is the Republican Party...
All adults, Too Conservative 38%, About right 25%, not conservative enough 13%, not sure 23%

https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/kvoamfqbbo/econTabReport.pdf

Basically, even in all categories. Now the biggest block of Americans think the Democrats are too liberal and the Republicans too conservative. Right around 40% for both parties which just happens to match the percentage of those who claim to be independents or not affiliated with either major party.

If you think the Democratic Party isnít liberal enough, this letís you know what percentage of other Americans agree with you. Same for about right and too liberal. I havenít run across a Republican on this site yet, but the same would apply to them as for being conservative.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

Top
#317034 - 10/22/19 03:47 AM Re: What is a far leftist, anyway? [Re: perotista]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 8951
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
I havenít run across a Republican on this site yet


That's just your timing. We certainly have had them here for a very long time.

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