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#320298 - 01/21/20 07:11 PM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17275
Loc: Florida
Quote:
We have managed to make endless war a consumer product and it's a truly monstrous vocation.


I just thought that needed to be repeated.
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#320315 - 01/21/20 07:58 PM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: pdx rick]
jgw Online   content
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3601
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I hate to say it but, it seems that our endless war started when we decided to fight a war in the Middle East. Then we got contaminated by the great Muslim war. There is a solution:

GET THE HELL OUT OF THE MIDDLE EAST - ALL THE WAY OUT!

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#320348 - 01/22/20 02:02 AM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 440
Originally Posted By: Greger
The distraction fizzled when Iran didn't take the bait.


That's the fun part of conspiracy theory logic. Even evidence against the Hypothesis is Just Proof Of How Good They Are.

Had we gotten into a shooting war with Iran, that would have been a high negative.

There remains:

No evidence whatsoever that Trump was ever likely to be removed prior to the strike.

No evidence whatsoever that the strike has in any meaningful way impacted impeachment proceedings.

No evidence whatsoever in favor of this particular conspiracy theory.
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#320352 - 01/22/20 05:30 AM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7264
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Have to agree.

Prince is just another corrupt businessman looking for ways to make a buck from the skein of corruption surrounding this WH. He's already rich ... and the world is not enough. But privatize the military would be ok with him ... and just think ... Mr Trump believes in a mercenary military ... could be a portend of lots of benjamins

There has been a long standing anti-Iran faction of advisors, politicians, and political thinkers in this country. Nothing really new about it. Kill them ... kill them all ... I think that is their motto
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#320353 - 01/22/20 05:35 AM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7264
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
As for the idea that Trump would have otherwise been removed by the Republican-dominated Senate ...
Now whatever you fill in the blank with ... the last word would be ABSURD!!!!!

I guarantee if Mr Trump strolled onto the Senate floor with a nice beaming halo and started shooting Democrats, no Republican would stop him and all of them would say that it was not an impeachable offense.

And that is the state of play in America today.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#320354 - 01/22/20 01:25 PM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10331
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
There remains:

No evidence whatsoever that Trump was ever likely to be removed prior to the strike.

No evidence whatsoever that the strike has in any meaningful way impacted impeachment proceedings.

No evidence whatsoever in favor of this particular conspiracy theory.

One important consideration that your assessment leaves out is; what was Trump thinking?

There were plenty of signs that he was (and still is) extremely concerned about being impeached. Seems that the most obvious answer for his assassination of Soleimani was a combination of a pathological need to lash out coupled with a long-standing strategic mini-plan to have a few easy to implement, dramatic “protect the nation against the bad guys” cans of whupass on the shelf for emergencies.

My leading “conspiracy theory” is that The Impetuous One indulged in a can of whupass to try and make himself feel better.

Only a naive intellectual would expect Trump’s actions to have any rational origins. dunce
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To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
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#320416 - 01/22/20 11:48 PM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: logtroll]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 440
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
There remains:

No evidence whatsoever that Trump was ever likely to be removed prior to the strike.

No evidence whatsoever that the strike has in any meaningful way impacted impeachment proceedings.

No evidence whatsoever in favor of this particular conspiracy theory.

One important consideration that your assessment leaves out is; what was Trump thinking?


:shrug: probably not too terribly much. Trump tends to make decisions on instinct.

Quote:
There were plenty of signs that he was (and still is) extremely concerned about being impeached. Seems that the most obvious answer for his assassination of Soleimani was a combination of a pathological need to lash out coupled with a long-standing strategic mini-plan to have a few easy to implement, dramatic “protect the nation against the bad guys” cans of whupass on the shelf for emergencies.

[quote]My leading “conspiracy theory” is that The Impetuous One indulged in a can of whupass to try and make himself feel better.

Only a naive intellectual would expect Trump’s actions to have any rational origins. dunce



You contradict yourself: Either Trump is an impetuous actor who makes decisions without deep rational exercise of thought... Or Trump is a thoughtful planner who makes reasoned assessments regarding the likely foreign and domestic impacts of his decisions and makes long-term decisions accordingly (such as the "mini strategy"'s you suggest). He is not both.

Frankly, the former is correct. If you want to argue that "Okay, the intel and military communities may have said X Y and Z, but Trump was super duper secretly thinking about impeachment!", well, that's a non-falsifiable statement. Which, indeed, as you suggest, would put it in the same category as other conspiracy theories.


Edited by CPWILL (01/22/20 11:49 PM)
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#320417 - 01/22/20 11:50 PM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 440
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
As for the idea that Trump would have otherwise been removed by the Republican-dominated Senate ...
Now whatever you fill in the blank with ... the last word would be ABSURD!!!!!

I guarantee if Mr Trump strolled onto the Senate floor with a nice beaming halo and started shooting Democrats, no Republican would stop him and all of them would say that it was not an impeachable offense.

And that is the state of play in America today.



laugh I think you'd have a few Republicans defect at that point, though, yes, you'd have some who would ask what the Democrats had done to deserve such a thing, and why the President was forced to defend himself in that manner, before declaring that Nothing Mattered Because He Hadn't Been Found Guilty In A Court Of Law laugh


And the same is generally true of all of us here in the U.S. today. Tribalism is a helluva drug.
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#320420 - 01/23/20 12:40 AM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10331
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
You contradict yourself:

Nuh-uh. Trump had him some advisors early on who would have known about keeping some ducks in the pond to shoot, and I expect he also had known the trick of getting some backup grenades in stock in preparation for contingencies from his other life as a mob boss.

It's a perfect theory...
_________________________
“You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
– R. Buckminster Fuller

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#320426 - 01/23/20 05:14 AM Re: ISIS Leader Killed in U.S. Special Operations Raid in Northern Syria [Re: logtroll]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 440
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
You contradict yourself:

Nuh-uh. Trump had him some advisors early on who would have known about keeping some ducks in the pond to shoot, and I expect he also had known the trick of getting some backup grenades in stock in preparation for contingencies from his other life as a mob boss.

It's a perfect theory...



Yeah, this reminds me of the "George Bush is a drooling idiot who can't string two words together but also an evil genius capably plotting world domination by manipulating entire regions" arguments that I heard back during the W administration. :roll:
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