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#320160 - 01/19/20 04:39 AM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 336
Originally Posted By: Greger
Hide and watch, pardner, she's toast.


ENTIRELY possible. I think, ultimately, it's likely - her brand here is not as solid as Bernie's. I simply note that that is not a foregone conclusion at this point, and that she retains powerful advocates in her corner. If she loses the CNN crowd, I agree, she's in real trouble.
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#320164 - 01/19/20 05:34 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16845
Loc: Florida
I tend not to be wishy washy in my opinions. Toast. I expect to see Buttigieg pass her in national polls soon. Or Bloomberg.
And with voting beginning soon it will be the kiss of death for her. There's no time to recover now.

I was hoping Biden might begin to fade a bit by now but it looks like he'll be losing to Trump in November. Democrats are going to be terribly upset. I'ma laugh my ass off...
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#320167 - 01/19/20 05:54 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: logtroll]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3239
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
If Bernie and Warren fixed their split one of them could win the election. If Bernie gets it he will lose the election. He simply has too much baggage and that title of Socialist doesn't help even a little bit. He is fair game. I have heard that the Republicans, right now, have a plan to get him the nod by voting for him in every primary that they can vote in. They would LOVE to see him run!

Now, about conservatives and Trump. The current Republican party is the party of Trump. Conservatives that vote for him do so holding their noses but they WILL vote for him. They consider, with some reason, the hate a declared Socialist. Sorry, its just the way it is. I have no problem with anybody supporting whoever they care to, its their right just as its my right to not support who they support. The Warren vs. Sanders thing is kinda helpful, from my standpoint, because they will split that vote and neither will get the nod.

I think its kindofa shame. The far left "Democratic Socialists" will, I believe, be responsible for giving Trump another term. Its really too bad. They had a chance to run and not scare away the independents, etc. but, instead, just had to run their mouths and spout absolutely nonsensical promises that cannot be kept. The reason for that is the incredible debt and payments thereof. This is not rocket science but a simple fact.

From my standpoint, wanting Trump gone more than any other thing for 2020 stands. My hope is that even the Democratic Socialists will understand that and vote Democratic regardless of who is the candidate for the Dems. Anybody who is not on board for that will be, as far as I am concerned, be responsible for the possible loss of Democracy in America. I know, its a kinda extreme position but I got lots of fellow travelers on this one and I believe our concerns have reason.

Just saying...............

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#320171 - 01/19/20 06:53 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: jgw]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 336
Originally Posted By: jgw
If Bernie and Warren fixed their split one of them could win the election. If Bernie gets it he will lose the election. He simply has too much baggage and that title of Socialist doesn't help even a little bit. He is fair game. I have heard that the Republicans, right now, have a plan to get him the nod by voting for him in every primary that they can vote in. They would LOVE to see him run!

Now, about conservatives and Trump. The current Republican party is the party of Trump. Conservatives that vote for him do so holding their noses but they WILL vote for him. They consider, with some reason, the hate a declared Socialist. Sorry, its just the way it is. I have no problem with anybody supporting whoever they care to, its their right just as its my right to not support who they support. The Warren vs. Sanders thing is kinda helpful, from my standpoint, because they will split that vote and neither will get the nod.

I think its kindofa shame. The far left "Democratic Socialists" will, I believe, be responsible for giving Trump another term. Its really too bad. They had a chance to run and not scare away the independents, etc. but, instead, just had to run their mouths and spout absolutely nonsensical promises that cannot be kept. The reason for that is the incredible debt and payments thereof. This is not rocket science but a simple fact.

From my standpoint, wanting Trump gone more than any other thing for 2020 stands. My hope is that even the Democratic Socialists will understand that and vote Democratic regardless of who is the candidate for the Dems. Anybody who is not on board for that will be, as far as I am concerned, be responsible for the possible loss of Democracy in America. I know, its a kinda extreme position but I got lots of fellow travelers on this one and I believe our concerns have reason.

Just saying...............


You sound like me in 2012 frown. Here's hoping you don't end up as bitter as I did.
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#320174 - 01/19/20 07:42 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16845
Loc: Florida
I'm perfectly fine with a second term for Trump. If Democrats can't nominate a progressive candidate then a second Trump term works better for me than Biden or some other neoliberal candidate.

Contrary to what jgw says, I believe that Sanders will inspire non voting independents who lean left to vote by the millions. The very people he accuses of costing Clinton the election will come out in droves to vote for him. It's not my worry if the vote blue no matter who crowd decides not to vote. Because SOCIALIZMS. Wooden that be a whooot! If the rightie dems sat it out and cost Sanders the election.

See, I'm not a big Bernie fan...I've got serious doubts about his executive skills and serious doubts that he will be successful as a president. But right now, he's probably the best of the batch as far as moving my agenda forward. A second term for Trump might move it forward faster.
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#320187 - 01/19/20 09:57 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 336
Originally Posted By: Greger
I'm perfectly fine with a second term for Trump. If Democrats can't nominate a progressive candidate then a second Trump term works better for me than Biden or some other neoliberal candidate.

Contrary to what jgw says, I believe that Sanders will inspire non voting independents who lean left to vote by the millions. The very people he accuses of costing Clinton the election will come out in droves to vote for him. It's not my worry if the vote blue no matter who crowd decides not to vote. Because SOCIALIZMS. Wooden that be a whooot! If the rightie dems sat it out and cost Sanders the election.

See, I'm not a big Bernie fan...I've got serious doubts about his executive skills and serious doubts that he will be successful as a president. But right now, he's probably the best of the batch as far as moving my agenda forward. A second term for Trump might move it forward faster.


David French makes a similar argument, but, I'm curious about that last sentence - how do you mean?
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#320188 - 01/20/20 12:01 AM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16845
Loc: Florida
Every day that Trump is in office he does more and more damage to the Republican Party. It's kind of a death by a thousand cuts thing.

Beyond that I see Biden as a single term do nothing president. Not popular with Democrats and much maligned by Republicans and the press. He will be defeated in 2024 by a Republican who will likely serve two terms. It will be 2032 before Democrats get another shot at it.

A second Trump term won't be as successful as the first, or as pretty. It'll be easy to elect a progressive on Trump's heels in 2024, then Democrats will hold the White House until 2032 and beyond.
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#320189 - 01/20/20 12:09 AM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 336
Originally Posted By: Greger
Every day that Trump is in office he does more and more damage to the Republican Party. It's kind of a death by a thousand cuts thing.

Beyond that I see Biden as a single term do nothing president. Not popular with Democrats and much maligned by Republicans and the press. He will be defeated in 2024 by a Republican who will likely serve two terms. It will be 2032 before Democrats get another shot at it.

A second Trump term won't be as successful as the first, or as pretty. It'll be easy to elect a progressive on Trump's heels in 2024, then Democrats will hold the White House until 2032 and beyond.


Thank you for explaining that to me.

I will say, that is pretty much what I as a conservative was hoping for for WRT a second Obama term. I think you may find yourself disappointed with the results of that strategy.


Edited by CPWILL (01/20/20 12:11 AM)
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#320195 - 01/20/20 01:08 AM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16845
Loc: Florida
If there's anything I've learned about politics it's that I will pretty much always be disappointed.
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#320212 - 01/20/20 03:36 PM Re: Warren v. Sanders [Re: Greger]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 570
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: Greger


A second Trump term won't be as successful as the first, or as pretty. It'll be easy to elect a progressive on Trump's heels in 2024, then Democrats will hold the White House until 2032 and beyond.


Historically-speaking, the left will hold office until things are looking good again.

Then the electorate goes out and finds themselves another preacher.
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