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#320471 - 01/24/20 04:14 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 435
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
For the record, this is not a terribly good counter to the suggestion that perhaps you are projecting your personal feelings onto an entire group of people who are your Other.

If it walks like a duck, and quack like a duck, it's a duck.

It's not Liberals who were protesting the take-down of Civil War monuments in Charlottesville, it was Conservatives.

Conniving dishonest sociopaths piss on peoples legs, and tell them that it's raining. The only light in your Conservative world, is gaslight. Own who you are. smile


smile Ask Jeff who I am. He's the one who invited me here. In the meantime, you may benefit from getting to know more people who aren't like you. wink Widen's the perspective wonderfully.
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#320472 - 01/24/20 04:33 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 435
Originally Posted By: Jeffery J. Haas
Originally Posted By: CPWILL


smile I'm in my mid 30s. A millennial, technically, according to some measures.


In 1985, presumably the year of your birth, Republicans and conservatives in general, were considered the CAUTIOUS wing of our electoral body. The Democrats were considered the dreamers and bold explorers.

Now, admit that there is nothing wrong with either position, and maybe even a lot of good in both as well.
Admit that and you can get a fairly decent picture of the notion that it's okay to disagree with and still respect your opposition.
You might want to go into outer space and explore new ways to harness technology for the greater good of mankind.
Your opposition wants to know how it gets paid for, and wants to hem in waste and fraud. Your opposition wants definable goals and provable hypotheses, and they want clearly defined fiscal restraints and a deadline.

Your opposition is the Republican Party, and you can't dispute their call for caution and frugality. They're just keeping you honest.


Hm. In 1985 we were in the middle of the Reagan Revolution. I think you are taking the natural Conservative instinct to conduct change wisely and assuming that it is only the drag on the Progressive sail. This would be a categorical error. Conservatism is it's own ideological set of positions, not simply a more cautious version of your own.

Quote:
Today, we are no longer bold dreamers, we are not Americans. We are not even considered to be human beings.

"Democrats are not Americans"


May I say that I enjoy the irony of you posting this in the very thread where another poster has been so insistent on the inherent evil and wickedness of conservatives? smile

Sadly, this is part of modern political life, not particular to one party or the other. More than 40% of Americans think the other side isn't just Wrong, but EVIL. Americans who demonstrate intellectual insularity (who live in bubbles) are the most likely to be proponents of wicked caricatures of the Other, to the point that 20% think the other side "lacks the qualities to be fully human."

It is extremely worrisome. Usually, tribal violence is preceded by a dehumanization campaign. In this case, we are providing that campaign ourselves, and paying our own tribal media to do it to us, for us. The more that we hate and loathe and look down on Americans who don't think the same things we do, the easier it is to justify abuse ("and, really, you know, our side isn't nearly as abusive as those awful Other Siders, anyway") which, in turn, becomes part of their narrative justifying worse abuse (And really, I mean, you have to, you know, after all - those Other Siders only understand one thing), and round and round and round we go.

Elites start to pick up on the fact that they can not only get away with it, but be lauded for it and rewarded by ever more loyal ever more strident political support bases and....

and... well, the short story is, this is pretty much how the Roman Republic self destructed.

Not a happy trend frown

Quote:
Suffice it to say that, for as long as you have been a politically aware adult, (assuming age fifteen as maybe the start date) all you know of liberals is that they are the Devil, they are not really true Americans, and they might not even be human beings.


Actually since I've been politically aware, (and yup, about High School), I've been surrounded by good liberals, bad liberals, good conservatives, bad conservatives. My father is a left leaning fellow, and is probably the best and wisest man I know. An extremely influential pair of teachers who invested in me in High School and who have shaped much of my adult life were conservatives, and were the kind of men who willingly spent hours upon hours helping kids. A college professor who I greatly respected and who wrote me a note once that is framed on my bookshelf was not only a leftist, but an actual political appointee from the Clinton Administration. I've been out serving others with liberals and conservatives alike. I have both liberals and conservatives in my church, though probably more of the latter.

I've also seen members of both sects go ugly. I've seen both fall to bigoted and stupid caricatures of the Other. I've seen both choose to isolate themselves in self-reinforcement bubbles that only push their tribal groupthink to extremes, resulting in opinions like the survey cited above. For every fellow insisting that conservatives are a bunch of stupid racists there is a right-winger out there yelling about the libtards and how much they hate America. Neither is impressive.


Quote:
I know, I know: "Okay Boomer!"


laugh Naturally.


Edited by CPWILL (01/24/20 04:38 AM)
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#320477 - 01/24/20 04:53 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43272
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...you may benefit from getting to know more people who aren't like you. wink Widen's the perspective wonderfully.

I hung with Conservatives for the first 18 years of my life. I'm good. smile
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#320481 - 01/24/20 05:01 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 435
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...you may benefit from getting to know more people who aren't like you. wink Widen's the perspective wonderfully.

I hung with Conservatives for the first 18 years of my life. I'm good. smile


Respectfully, looking at the close-minded nature of your judgements regarding the people you Other, I can't concur with that judgement. frown You don't sound "good" at all, but, rather, angry, derisive, bitter, and bigoted.


Edited by CPWILL (01/24/20 05:04 AM)
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#320483 - 01/24/20 05:41 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43272
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Respectfully, looking at the close-minded nature of your judgements regarding the people you Other, I can't concur with that judgement. frown You don't sound "good" at all, but, rather, angry, derisive, bitter, and bigoted.

Naw mang, I recognize that Conservative are bad people who are afraid of their own shadows. It's not their fault, they were born that way. Hmm

Conservatives Big on Fear, Brain Study Finds
Psychology Today

(No wonder Conservatives hate science. coffee )

smile
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#320484 - 01/24/20 05:42 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43272
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
You don't sound "good" at all, but, rather, angry, derisive, bitter, and bigoted.

Project much? crazy

How's that "Jews will not replace us" working out for you Conservatives? smile
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#320485 - 01/24/20 01:10 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 435
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
You don't sound "good" at all, but, rather, angry, derisive, bitter, and bigoted.

Project much?


Not in this instance, but, then, in this instance, I'm not the one insisting that everyone who thinks differently than me is evil because I don't like my parents.

Quote:
How's that "Jews will not replace us" working out for you Conservatives? smile


Oh, that's adorable. You think anti-semitism is unique to the Right at all? smile
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#320486 - 01/24/20 01:15 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 435
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Respectfully, looking at the close-minded nature of your judgements regarding the people you Other, I can't concur with that judgement. frown You don't sound "good" at all, but, rather, angry, derisive, bitter, and bigoted.

Naw mang, I recognize that Conservative are bad people who are afraid of their own shadows. It's not their fault, they were born that way. Hmm

Conservatives Big on Fear, Brain Study Finds
Psychology Today

(No wonder Conservatives hate science. coffee )

smile


:lol: reminds me of the old claims that opposition to socialism was a psychological malady, and the "authoritarian mindset" people. Or, for that matter, the Liberalism is a Mental Disorder people. laugh


If you want junk claims that you are wonderful and the Other is icky, well, stick with that. There's a lot of people willing to sell it to you, and lots of people (on both sides) foolish and egocentric enough to want to buy it.

If you want to actually understand people better, I might recommend the work of (liberal atheist) Jonathan Haidt. You might be surprised wink


Edited by CPWILL (01/24/20 01:21 PM)
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#320487 - 01/24/20 02:07 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10328
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
... lots of people (on both sides) foolish and egocentric enough to want to buy it.

Is there really only two sides?
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To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.”
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#320488 - 01/24/20 02:19 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: logtroll]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
... lots of people (on both sides) foolish and egocentric enough to want to buy it.

Is there really only two sides?


You're lucky you get two.
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