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#320329 - 01/21/20 09:02 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7092
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
No, that is the fairy tale that people on the left tell themselves so that they can feel morally superior.
IMMIGRATION

It was the inspiration for many on the right. Remember ... I am going to build a beautiful wall so tall and so great it will keep out all those uncleans who are rapists etc etc. It is a metaphor, a dog whistle, code for large scale public bigotry. I know I know ... people on the right just don't get it. They "know" they are not bigots, why hell they all have black friends.

I live in a suburban/rural community and am awash with Trump supporters. 100% bigots. It is not a matter of moral superiority or any superiority ... it is just a fact.

Quote:
Trump didn't get elected Because Yay Racism ... he was less-awful than Hillary
First, how can you say Sec Clinton was more awful than the puzzygrabbing, huckster, bigot, and unethical businessman? Sec Clinton was once again cleared of wrongdoing by the DoJ. Mr Trump has been and continues to be under a cloud of criminal investigations, and his voters don't care. That is the primary difference. He is their voice and they don't care if he is corrupt. And he is certainly far more corrupt than Sec Clinton has ever been characterized.

Second and more importantly, Mr Trump's Base, THE BASE, of the Republican party is probably about 75% heavily influenced by their bigotry. They Democrats for several reason, and one of the primary ones is Democrats help blacks. The reason elected Republicans fear Mr Trump is because he is the voice of THE BASE, and that voice is the sound of bigotry. If you are disloyal to Mr Trump you will get the wrath of THE BASE. I am surrounded by his base.

Quote:
There are a couple of key drivers of that, and one of them is definitely that the charge of racism was laughingly dismissed where it wasn't considered a badge of honor because they saw that the left liked to claim that anything the left didn't like was racist
This is a favorite meme of the right. But if you analyze the facts Democrats do not call people who are not racists racists. The problem is the right does not understand what it means to be racist. In their mind, and I will be exaggerating for effect, they believe a person is racist who thinks they should own black people. Thus precluding everything which defines bigotry as bigotry. Hence they are not bigot and Democrats only use the term as verbal assault when not true.

We have a local talk show host who uses the Chicago crime report as a basis for characterizing blacks as predisposed for violence and then claim that is not racist, but tough love. Really!!!! You may see it the same way, but I guarantee you, that is as racist as it sounds. White people are better than blacks because they are not shooting each other ... make sense?
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
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#320344 - 01/22/20 01:45 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 201
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
America's original sin was steeped in Conservatism. Conservatives are all about racism and bigotry.


See, when you lead off with something as powerfully ignorant as that, it makes it really hard to take anything else you say seriously.

I'm gonna go way out on a limb and suggest you have little to zero study in the intellectual history of conservatism.

If you do the Great Courses, however, there's a neat little remedy to that I can recommend.
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

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#320347 - 01/22/20 01:58 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 201
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
No, that is the fairy tale that people on the left tell themselves so that they can feel morally superior.
IMMIGRATION

It was the inspiration for many on the right. Remember ... I am going to build a beautiful wall so tall and so great it will keep out all those uncleans who are rapists etc etc. It is a metaphor, a dog whistle, code for large scale public bigotry.


I always find it interesting when leftists insist that right wingers are sounding dog whistles, but that the only people who can hear them are leftists.

Wishing to have an actual enforcement of our immigration policy - rule of law - is not "racism".

Quote:
I live in a suburban/rural community and am awash with Trump supporters. 100% bigots.


Since you choose to define "bigot" as "Trump supporter", it's not surprising you arrived at that conclusion. All that does, however, is teach others not to take you seriously when you accuse someone of bigotry.

Quote:
Quote:
Trump didn't get elected Because Yay Racism ... he was less-awful than Hillary
First, how can you say Sec Clinton was more awful than the puzzygrabbing, huckster, bigot, and unethical businessman?


I have a list of reasons why I think she was terrible, many of them policy related, many of them particular to her, her husband, and the unethical cabal they surrounded themselves with. Personally I considered both of them disasters beyond the pale, and voted for the former CIA guy out in Utah.

Quote:
Sec Clinton was once again cleared of wrongdoing by the DoJ. Mr Trump has been and continues to be under a cloud of criminal investigations, and his voters don't care. That is the primary difference. He is their voice and they don't care if he is corrupt.


Indeed. Just as many of Bill Clinton's supporters didn't care about his abuses, nor Hillary's about hers. Tribalism is a helluva drug.

Quote:
Second and more importantly, Mr Trump's Base, THE BASE, of the Republican party is probably about 75% heavily influenced by their bigotry.


Impressive. Every claim in that statement is false.

1. Trump's won the 2016 GOP primary with a distinct plurality. The majority of the GOP base voted against him.

2. The base that came out and voted for him was often marginally-at-best connected to the party, and were often democrats.

3. A trend which showed up again when he won the General by pulling in traditional democrat voters in key areas.

Quote:
Quote:
There are a couple of key drivers of that, and one of them is definitely that the charge of racism was laughingly dismissed where it wasn't considered a badge of honor because they saw that the left liked to claim that anything the left didn't like was racist
This is a favorite meme of the right. But if you analyze the facts Democrats do not call people who are not racists racists.


Yeah, I'm just gonna let this hang right here. :p
_________________________
Winter Is Coming

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#320349 - 01/22/20 03:42 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 42502
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
America's original sin was steeped in Conservatism. Conservatives are all about racism and bigotry.


See, when you lead off with something as powerfully ignorant as that, it makes it really hard to take anything else you say seriously.

Ok Boomer...

My history of Conservatism begins with Reagan. What I have seen of Conservatism, what they say, how they act, how they treat others especially the poor, minorities, women, LGBT since I have been cognizant of the world around me, has informed my view of what a Conservative is. Sounds like that reality upsets you.

Hmm

For the recored, my parents voted Republican. Both of my parents were racist, misogynistic, patriarchal, homophobic and xenophobic. I moved out two months BEFORE my 18th birthday - I couldn't wait to escape those people.
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#320350 - 01/22/20 03:45 AM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 42502
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
I'm gonna go way out on a limb and suggest you have little to zero study in the intellectual history of conservatism.

If you do the Great Courses, however, there's a neat little remedy to that I can recommend.

I don't need some archaic dusty old book to tell me what a Conservative is, I can form my own opinion based upon observation. smile
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#320357 - 01/22/20 02:10 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
Hamish Howl Offline
newbie

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 487
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
I'm gonna go way out on a limb and suggest you have little to zero study in the intellectual history of conservatism.

If you do the Great Courses, however, there's a neat little remedy to that I can recommend.

I don't need some archaic dusty old book to tell me what a Conservative is, I can form my own opinion based upon observation. smile


Another way of saying that is that the term "conservative" that we grew up with is totally alien to today's GOP.
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What can we do to help you stop screaming?

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#320371 - 01/22/20 05:33 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: Hamish Howl]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15422
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
I'm gonna go way out on a limb and suggest you have little to zero study in the intellectual history of conservatism.

If you do the Great Courses, however, there's a neat little remedy to that I can recommend.

I don't need some archaic dusty old book to tell me what a Conservative is, I can form my own opinion based upon observation. smile


Another way of saying that is that the term "conservative" that we grew up with is totally alien to today's GOP.


I look and look and look today but I see little to nothing in today's Republican Party that reminds me of a Barry Goldwater, a Nelson Rockefeller, Bob Dole, or even a John McCain.
Justin Amash was maybe the last vestige of it, and he's out now.
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deepfreezefilms.com

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#320384 - 01/22/20 06:12 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16498
Loc: Florida
But there are still Republicans who imagine themselves to be a part of this dead ideology. Old fashioned conservatism has long since given way to the new better model. More guns, more god, and less people of color.

Republicanism is not conservatism. Today's Democrats are more conservative than your average Trump voter. Although they use the term loudly and proudly. In a word, they have become radicalized.

If the Republican Party hopes to become conservative again it needs to purge the white supremecists, the nationalists, the Nazis, The KKK, Evangelical Christians, and corrupt elected officials who have turned it into the circus of bigotry that it is today. Republicans have catered to the desires of that crowd until they have simply become that crowd.

But at least we have them all corralled in one place for now.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#320387 - 01/22/20 06:23 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: Hamish Howl]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3062
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Actually, it doesn't. When you have companies like Standard Oil and Amazon paying no taxes at all whilst everybody working is having taxes ripped right out of their paychecks kinda shows that. Its kinda like saying that tariffs are not taxes.

I guess what I am really saying is that they do bring income but they are simply not fair. I think that fairness, by government, makes people more favorable to government which is a good thing. Our system of taxes may bring in the bucks but it certainly doesn't have favor with the common citizen that pays them.

I am not for bankrupting the rich. I am, however, in favor of taxing the very rich more than the plain rich and am for taxing those a bit more than those not rich. We have done that for a very long time. Right up until we had the Trump tax cut which increased our national debt by 1+ trillion a year.

That bill, I fear, will be the sin that eventually brought down the United States of America.

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#320390 - 01/22/20 06:32 PM Re: US budget deficit hits $984 billion, highest in 7 years [Re: pdx rick]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16498
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Ok Boomer...

My history of Conservatism begins with Reagan.


Lucky you! Mine began with Nixon. We share The Bushes.

My history of Liberalism began with Kennedy and saw LBJ and Carter along the way. I was more or less okay with Bubba, it was about then that Republicans totally went off the deep end and became the corrupt body that they are today.
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Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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