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#323717 - 04/01/20 05:53 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Greger]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 42732
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Greger
But the consequences of a Biden administration may be worse than a second Trump term.

Joe Biden is not Donald Trump.

Trump came into office with no understanding of how the government works at all and no apparent desire to learn. That's not Joe Biden.

Presidents ave tended to have some form of executive branch experience or prior work as governors, in which they are forced to manage in a crisis. That is Joe Biden.

One of Trumpís major flaws is his distrust of expertise. That is largely what the federal government is: an army of subject-matter experts overseeing their own areas of responsibility. A president needs to understand how to use that apparatus to detect emerging disasters and respond to them as theyíre coming. Instead, Trump dismisses these experts as the "deep state." That is not Joe Biden.

I understand how you feel Greger, because I felt the same way about Hillary Clinton - and a lot of people did not understand my thinking about the difference between Hillary and Trump. I simply sussed it down to they were both lying conniving sociopaths. That is not Joe Biden. Hmm
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#323782 - 04/02/20 04:31 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: pdx rick]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pdx rick

I understand how you feel Greger, because I felt the same way about Hillary Clinton - and a lot of people did not understand my thinking about the difference between Hillary and Trump. I simply sussed it down to they were both lying conniving sociopaths. That is not Joe Biden. Hmm


I don't. I am not a fan of Hillary, but when I hear "Hillary is worse than Trump!", this is what I see.
Now add in a face mask because:TRUMP-virus

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#323865 - 04/05/20 02:46 AM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Justin Rosario- AGAIN (LOL)

Justin Rosario
2 hrs ∑
So Joe Rogan, that cool dude the Bernie campaign was soooooo excited to tout as an endorsement, just said he would vote for Trump over Biden.

And here you have the perfect encapsulation of the Bro.
It was -never- about anything having to do with progress or progressives. EVER.

It was -always- about centering white men again. Biden will not do that. Bernie's "revolution" that pushes civil rights, reproductive rights, LGBTQ rights, and immigrant rights to the back of the bus will.

When Bernie is gone, they will look for another figurehead to lead the "revolution" that will just so happen to place white men at the center of everything again.

This is why they do not find the GOP a greater threat. After all, the entire Republican Party is about putting white men in charge of everything. The Democratic Party is about sharing power with people from all walks of life.

The Democratic Party is the enemy because they are moving away from this paradigm and it enrages the white men who think power should be theirs and theirs alone.

This is who Bros are. They are not progressives. They do not care about the progressive agenda. They care about putting Those People back in their place. This is why they are so hostile to women and minorities.

Sooner or later, they'll give up and find their way to the GOP and insist that we "forced" them to leave the party. Guaranteed.
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#323869 - 04/05/20 04:48 AM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16832
Loc: Florida
Rogan's a right leaning independent, a libertarian, basically a small R republican. He's probably fine with Trump and likely hated Obama. He'd have crossed over for Bernie. Not for Obama's houseboy. Many Republicans would have crossed party lines for Bernie because Bernie is a man of the people.

And he's NOT a Democrat.

So why do you feel this powerful urge to attack people who like Bernie? It's almost an obsession.

Rogan's endorsement wasn't exactly well accepted when it happened and everybody tried to pretend it never happened but it did and it speaks volumes about how far reaching the r/evolution has become. Rogan aint a lefty by any means but he's a real clear thinker. He aint the sort of feller you want to find yourself in a debate with. He'd shred the likes of us like cobwebs. Calls a great fight though!

Can they get Khabib Nurmegomedov out of Russia for UFC 249....Biggest pay per view in history in an empty stadium! And Joe Rogan aint gonna call it. Such a time to be alive!
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#323870 - 04/05/20 05:19 AM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16832
Loc: Florida
"Hillary is worse than Trump!"

I happen to like Hillary a lot. I liked Bill too. For a Democrat he's really not that bad. He's from Arkansas y'know. Bless his heart.

I wish we had someone of his calibre up to bat right now. Or her calibre. We got Biden instead.

Trump will be immeasurably worse than Biden! That's the whole point. To drive the stake through the heart of the Republican Party. The next four years are gonna be no picnic, might's well let it be them gets all the blame for it. Then in 2024 AOC and her tits will become the first Puerto Rican president.
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#323873 - 04/05/20 12:55 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
perotista Offline
journeyman

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 587
That's a matter of personal preference, ideology, beliefs and how one looks at things. I liked Bill Clinton too although I voted for Perot twice. I rank Bill either three or four on my list of best presidents in my life time. He's behind IKE and JFK, then depending on the day whether Bill or Reagan is three and four or the other way around.

Hillary, I never could stand. Hence my vote against both Trump and Hillary in 2016 by casting a ballot for Johnson. I'd do the same today even knowing what I know. In fact most of those who did vote third party against both would do the same thing today if given a second chance, some 9 million voters. Such was the dislike for both major party candidates.

Being I'm no ideologue or even much partisan, Biden suits me to a Tee. I started off in 2016 backing Jim Webb, when he didn't campaign because the fix was in for Hillary, I switched to John Kasich and when Trump won the nomination, supported Gary Johnson. Not so much as I liked Johnson as he was a third name on the ballot that wasn't Trump nor Clinton. Any third name would have done. Those two disgusted me to no end.

I did find it amusing that in February of 2016 a poll showed 56% of all Americans wanted the Democrats to nominate someone other than Clinton. Of course the Democrats ignored America as a whole which was their right. All Americans don't decide the Democratic nominee, Democrats do. But all of America does decide the general election. The writing was on the wall that early that Hillary would have trouble winning. She was just plain disliked by a majority of Americans. So too was Trump as you could see in their unfavorable ratings on election day. 58% of all Americans viewed Hillary unfavorably, 60% view Trump unfavorably. The first time in our history that any major party presidential candidate was viewed unfavorably by 50% or more of all Americans. Goldwater back in 1964 held the previous record for the highest unfavorable's at 47%. Both Hillary and Trump smashed his record. Now Barry can rest in peace knowing he wasn't the most disliked of any presidential candidates. Trump and Hillary hold that honor.
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#323879 - 04/05/20 07:21 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Greger]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Greger


So why do you feel this powerful urge to attack people who like Bernie? It's almost an obsession.


I feel the need to attack stealth Trumpers who will do anything to attack Democrats who would gladly vote for Bernie but who will do the practical thing to get rid of Trump if the numbers don't show up for Bernie like they hoped.
In the end, Rogan is a Trumper. As he has just now indicated.
In the end, if we can't have Bernie, that is not an excuse to invite Trump to end whatever we still have left of a democratic republic.
In the end, I attack people like Rogan because of self preservation.

In the end, I am confident that any of us here could shred Joe Rogan in a debate about anything.
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#324010 - 04/08/20 04:09 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 42732
Loc: Puget Sound, WA


Bernie is dropping out.

Bernie ignited a movement that rapidly pulled the Dems further left than was imaginable just four years ago. His ideas are the future. Thatís Bernie's victory. smile

Dems want Trump out of the office, they don't want a revolution as well...at this time. Hmm
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#324013 - 04/08/20 04:31 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: pdx rick]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: pdx rick


Bernie is dropping out.

Bernie ignited a movement that rapidly pulled the Dems further left than was imaginable just four years ago. His ideas are the future. Thatís Bernie's victory. smile

Dems want Trump out of the office, they don't want a revolution as well...at this time. Hmm


It's a tragedy that the youth vote let him down.
It's a tragedy that Bernie did not get the chance he deserved.
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deepfreezefilms.com

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#324014 - 04/08/20 04:47 PM Re: First Bernie Sanders Thread 2020 [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
perotista Offline
journeyman

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 587
This surprises me, I didn't think Sanders would drop out. That he would carry his campaign all the way to the convention as a platform for his ideas. Did Sanders move the Democratic Party to the left, I think he did some. I would say four years ago progressives made up somewhere between 20-25% of the Democratic Party faithful. That over the last four years they have increased to around 35%. The more moderate faction, the more Democratic Party traditionalist still have a majority. That could be changing, it probably is.

But the big question isn't so much about the Democratic Party faithful as it is with what we call swing voters, independents, those who aren't affiliated with either party. Those who are less partisan to being non-partisan. Has Sanders changed some of these folks thinking? Most independents which according to Gallup on 22 Mar make up 36% of the electorate. A lot of these so called swing voters became independents because their philosophy, ideology falls somewhere in-between the two major parties as the GOP has moved more to the right and the Democrats more to the left. Call it electability is probably the major reason why Biden has now won the Democratic nomination.

I wish Sanders well. One last thing, Sanders is a self described Democratic Socialist which doesn't play well among independents. In fact only 45% of all independents said they would think about voting for a socialist. The rest wouldn't regardless of the candidates.

Socialism and Atheism Still U.S. Political Liabilities


Now if someone else had professed Sanders ideas, someone who hadn't described themselves as a Democratic Socialist, his ideas probably would fly. A Biden, Klobuchar, Bloomberg, Steyer, Buttigieg, others of the more moderate views wouldn't have been stigmatized as being a socialist, a losing proposition come the general.

Who the messenger is sometimes make all the difference.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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