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#323942 - 04/07/20 04:08 AM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: Livetoride]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16862
Loc: Florida
Quote:
What the heck is so bad about a Biden/K. Harris ticket?


Harris is from California, Biden's already got California tied up so she brings nothing to the table. Whomever he chooses I imagine it will be completely uninspiring...like when Obama chose Biden.
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#323946 - 04/07/20 04:29 AM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: danarhea]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 9855
Loc: North San Diego County
It would be a smart move to form an alliance by choosing a progressive VP. If Biden picked Warren, he would get everybody left of Mich McTurtle voting for him.

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#323952 - 04/07/20 12:38 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: danarhea]
perotista Offline
journeyman

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 603
The Northeast is solid Democratic, Warren brings nothing to the table in helping Biden get to 270. Besides she is 70 years old, Biden needs someone younger. She could ensure the progressive vote, but that would be in states that wouldn't help Biden get to 270.

Klobuchar, Baldwin, Whitmer would be better choices numbers wise. Hillary won Minnesota by a single point in 2016 and lost Wisconsin and Michigan. Each of those three would ensure their state goes Democratic and each would help in the Midwest. Whitmer would be especially a positive as she would help Biden gain Ohio along with Michigan.

Picking Harris, who cares if Biden wins California by 3 million or 4 million votes. She won't help help him outside of California. One not mentioned much is Masto, Nevada. An Hispanic who would ensure Nevada stays blue, she would help in Arizona and Texas. Probably with her on the ticket, Arizona turns blue.

Of course being a numbers guy, I look at the VP nomination from that perspective. Who would be best in helping Biden get to 270. Ideology doesn't enter into my equation. I don't think Warren would help in Pennsylvania, Michigan, Ohio, Wisconsin or Minnesota to include Arizona where someone else very well could. Besides, Warren doesn't bring any regional balance to the ticket. Any of those I mentioned does.

With Warren, maybe you attract an additional million votes in the Northeast, but no additional electoral votes. With Harris, perhaps you attract an additional million votes on the west coast, but no additional electoral votes. With those I mention, the possibility exist, almost guaranteed to attract more electoral votes. Perhaps the question is, do you want to win or do you want to stay ideological pure?

I'm old school here. You first must win in order to accomplish anything. Staying ideological pure and losing accomplishing nothing.
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It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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#323965 - 04/07/20 05:31 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3251
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
SPOT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh, I would prefer Harris as the new AG.

I think Biden will be just fine. he is an institutionalist, understands gov, and understands what regular presidents do, which is, basically, appoint people he trusts and who are expected to do their jobs. He will also have no problem in assigning extra jobs to picked folks who can get said jobs done.

What I would REALLY like to see is something like the Hoover commission to examine and fix a seriously embattled and beat up gov. That was done, by president Truman in 1947, and was responsible for no less than 7 major government overhauls. We can, sure as hell, need something like that again! This will be really necessary after the disaster that will be passed on. Oh, google "hoover commission" for a LOT more on this one.


Edited by jgw (04/07/20 05:43 PM)

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#323968 - 04/07/20 06:19 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: jgw]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16862
Loc: Florida
Quote:
I think Biden will be just fine. he is an institutionalist, understands gov, and understands what regular presidents do, which is, basically, appoint people he trusts and who are expected to do their jobs. He will also have no problem in assigning extra jobs to picked folks who can get said jobs done.


That's the truth of it, he'll probably be fine.

But I gotta tell ya...I'm uneasy about it. Is it too soon to be talking about 2024?
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#323978 - 04/07/20 07:51 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: jgw]
perotista Offline
journeyman

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 603
Originally Posted By: jgw
SPOT ON!!!!!!!!!!!!

Oh, I would prefer Harris as the new AG.

I think Biden will be just fine. he is an institutionalist, understands gov, and understands what regular presidents do, which is, basically, appoint people he trusts and who are expected to do their jobs. He will also have no problem in assigning extra jobs to picked folks who can get said jobs done.

What I would REALLY like to see is something like the Hoover commission to examine and fix a seriously embattled and beat up gov. That was done, by president Truman in 1947, and was responsible for no less than 7 major government overhauls. We can, sure as hell, need something like that again! This will be really necessary after the disaster that will be passed on. Oh, google "hoover commission" for a LOT more on this one.


I agree, another Hoover type commission would be excellent.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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#323981 - 04/07/20 09:09 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: Greger]
Jeffery J. Haas Offline
It's the Despair Quotient!
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 08/03/04
Posts: 15728
Loc: Whittier, California
Originally Posted By: Greger
LOLs
All democratic failures of the last century are entirely the fault of non Democrats who didn't vote for a party they aren't members of.

What concessions will Biden offer the left for our votes?

I expect nothing, I don't think he realizes they even exist.

But it will be their fault if he loses.

The next president is going to get f*cked seven ways from Sunday and be left a dry withered husk. Because he cannot say yes to everyone all at once.

I sure wish Hillary was president right now.


How about I ask:

Do you honestly believe Humphrey would have been worse than Nixon?
Do you honestly believe Carter (2nd term) would have been worse than Reagan?
Do you honestly believe Gore would have been worse than Bush?
Do you honestly believe Hillary would have been worse than Trump?

Clearly you seem to believe Biden is worse than Trump...but I could be wrong wink
I'm often wrong about a lot of things, but about Biden, I am confident that I am not. He's definitely no Bernie Sanders, but he's definitely an upgrade from Trump.
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#323984 - 04/07/20 09:43 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: danarhea]
perotista Offline
journeyman

Registered: 09/05/19
Posts: 603
I decided to do some research. I've said all along that independents decide close national elections. Using Jeffery's years looking at just independents and only independents.
1968 Nixon 45%, Humphrey 41%, Wallace 18%
1980 Reagan 56%, Carter 31%, Anderson 13%
2000 Bush 48%, Gore 46%, Other 6%
2016 Trump 46%, Clinton 42%, other 6%

So it seems Gregory is right. The failure of the Democratic nominee rests with independents, not with the Democratic base or those who identify or affiliate with the Democratic Party. It's the swing voter, the non-affiliated, less to non-partisan voter that decides close election. It's how they view the candidates, their perspective of the candidates, whether they like them or not. Not what you or I think of the candidates.

The trick to winning elections is to nominate a candidate that is attractive to the independent, swing voter. Those are the ones that you need to convince your candidate is better than the other candidate. Neither major party can win a presidential election by itself, both need help and support from the independents, swing voters. The voters who don't belong to any party.
_________________________
It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.

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#323995 - 04/07/20 11:15 PM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: Greger]
Livetoride Offline
journeyman

Registered: 12/02/03
Posts: 628
Loc: Tennessee
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
What the heck is so bad about a Biden/K. Harris ticket?


Harris is from California, Biden's already got California tied up so she brings nothing to the table. Whomever he chooses I imagine it will be completely uninspiring...like when Obama chose Biden.

Fair enough, but I only threw a name out. I do believe it'll be a female and a female of color makes a l lot of sense to me. I'll gladly go left of center to get rid of this guy.
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#324000 - 04/08/20 01:35 AM Re: My vote will be for Biden, and this is why [Re: Jeffery J. Haas]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 16862
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Clearly you seem to believe Biden is worse than Trump...but I could be wrong

Quite wrong. I've stated many times that Biden will be far better than Trump. But he'll still lose in 2024 to a Republican.

My problem with Biden is that he will be the last Democratic president until 2032.
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