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#326160 - 05/28/20 03:45 PM The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo"
pdx rick Offline
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Quote:
A new iteration of the militia movement, boogaloo was born out of internet forums for gun enthusiasts that repurposed the 1984 movie Breakin’ 2: Electric Boogaloo as a code for a second civil war, and then modified it into phrases like “big luau” to create an insular community for those in on the joke, with Hawaiian-style shirts functioning as an in-real-life identifier. Boogaloo gained currency as an internet meme over the summer of 2019, when it was adopted by white supremacists in the accelerationist tendency. In January, the movement made the leap from the internet to the streets when a group boogaloo-ers showed up at the Second Amendment rally in Richmond, Va.

- Raw Story
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#326161 - 05/28/20 04:26 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
Greger Online   content


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Loc: Florida
Along and along a clash with cops is inevitable. They get ballsier every year and the courts have given them nothing but victories.
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#326173 - 05/28/20 10:35 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
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I doubt the cops will put up with that nonsense. The first time one of these boogaloo revolutionaries fires a shot at a protest, they will all be massacred. Police generally support Second Amendment Rights, right up until the guns are being pointed at them.

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#326177 - 05/28/20 11:19 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
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Gee ... I was thinking the police may join them
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#326178 - 05/28/20 11:52 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

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Many already have.
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#326180 - 05/29/20 02:11 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
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But join them in what?, is the question. Sure police like guns. Until the militia boys do something that gets them arrested, somebody shoots at a cop, and then all the cops return fire. If these guys are anti-government, does that mean they will fight government agents?

I think it's a confused mess right now because of Trump. The Secret Service for example might have some members with conservative philosophies, but if some militia starts shooting at them, they will wipe them out.

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#326184 - 05/29/20 03:45 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
I doubt the cops will put up with that nonsense. The first time one of these boogaloo revolutionaries fires a shot at a protest, they will all be massacred. Police generally support Second Amendment Rights, right up until the guns are being pointed at them.


That's my impression from most of them. Boogalooers seem to generally be more "Revolutionary Cosplay" than actual militia members willing to actually go toe to toe with a state security force.

For one thing, the latter group tend to be much less prominent about who they are on social media.
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#326188 - 05/29/20 04:43 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
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Have you heard of the Cult of Personality?

Conservatives demonized FBI agents for their political views and comments regarding our most righteous supreme master of the universe, but they say nothing about all the right wing tools who work for the government. My guess is a large chunk of SS or FBI or local/regional Leo's are Trump supporters. Why would anyone think these folks would not simply cross the lines and join their brethren, the anarchists?
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without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326191 - 05/29/20 05:40 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Have you heard of the Cult of Personality?

Conservatives demonized FBI agents for their political views and comments regarding our most righteous supreme master of the universe, but they say nothing about all the right wing tools who work for the government. My guess is a large chunk of SS or FBI or local/regional Leo's are Trump supporters. Why would anyone think these folks would not simply cross the lines and join their brethren, the anarchists?


....respectfully, the anarchists and the pro-LE conservatives aren't really what you call "brothers".
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#326195 - 05/29/20 08:17 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
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I think the FBI has a very thin layer of Trump supporters at the top. Rank and file were extremely pissed when Comey got fired. A lot of agents actually went to law school. A lot of very smart people who can just keep their heads down until Trump is gone. Won't be long now.
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#326199 - 05/29/20 08:25 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
pdx rick Offline
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Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
A lot of very smart people who can just keep their heads down until Trump is gone. Won't be long now.

Can't wait! smile
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#326211 - 05/30/20 03:31 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
why would you not think anarchical libertarians don't support LE?

These folks hate the federal government. Think Bannon and his deconstruction of the federal government. He loves LE and I am sure libertarians would love to do some deconstructing.

I think what you see as philosophically disparate does not imply they would not hold hands and fiddle as Washington goes up in flames.


Edited by rporter314 (05/30/20 03:49 AM)
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without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326212 - 05/30/20 03:48 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
I wouldn't count those chickens yet.

Mr Trump has already planted the seeds of a rigged election (so why is it not rigged when a Republican wins???) in case he loses. This is more than an exercise spitballing in some late night coffee shop about the pros and cons of Zen. The current crop of Republicans are complicit in his delusion and there is an outside possibility the SC will uphold any suit alleging rampant voter fraud and throw the election to Mr Trump. We have Senate Republicans doing political hit jobs for Mr Trump, so why not consider he may not leave office? Who would escort him out of the WH? He is the CiC. If Mr Trump says the election was illegitimate, why would the military not consider him to still be CiC? Would the joint chiefs take military action? I think not.

One may think I am a bit speculative, but I am not speculating about his personality disorder. He is a narcissist. To what ends would a narcissist go to fulfill their delusion ... especially if he is the most powerful person in the world.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326214 - 05/30/20 03:30 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
I wouldn't count those chickens yet.

Mr Trump has already planted the seeds of a rigged election (so why is it not rigged when a Republican wins???)


Do you think he'll blame Diebold voting machines, the SCOTUS, Russian Interference, or voter suppression?
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#326216 - 05/30/20 03:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
why would you not think anarchical libertarians don't support LE?


Because they don't. Have you spent much time in their social media? I get a bit of it washed over from some libertarian ties.

Anarchial Libertarians:

1. Can be both left or right wing, and
2. Don't generally think much of cops at all, seeing them rather as an oppressive standing army that suppresses individual liberty.


Quote:
These folks hate the federal government. Think Bannon and his deconstruction of the federal government. He loves LE and I am sure libertarians would love to do some deconstructing.


Bannon and his ilk is on the opposite side of the conservative spectrum from the Libertarians - they are Big State, Big Government, Nationalists.

Quote:
I think what you see as philosophically disparate does not imply they would not hold hands and fiddle as Washington goes up in flames.


The Anarchists want to be rid of Washington. The Statists want to rule it.
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#326224 - 05/30/20 07:45 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17062
Loc: Florida
You got to burn that MF to the ground before you rule it.
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#326226 - 05/30/20 08:15 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
Do you think he'll blame Diebold voting machines, the SCOTUS, Russian Interference, or voter suppression?

For starters Mr Trump is a well known liar. He is a narcissist and is therefore compelled to lie to maintain his delusions he is the greatest human to have ever lived etc etc. So does it really matter which and how many scapegoats he uses to incite {{{{THE BASE}}}}.

Originally Posted By: Verified Voting Foundation, Inc.
Far too many states use unreliable and insecure electronic voting machines, and many states have made their situation worse by adding some forms of Internet voting for some voters, which cannot be checked for accuracy at all. Even in states where verifiable systems are used, too often the check on the voting system’s function and accuracy is not done. The voting equipment now in use are aging; resources are severely impacted by the state of the economy over the past several years; shortages of both equipment and human resources are likely. After all the effort necessary to overcome the other hurdles to casting a ballot, it is patently unfair that once you get to the ballot box, that the ballot itself fails you. Taken together, these problems threaten to silently disenfranchise voters, potentially in sufficient numbers to alter outcomes.

So clearly he would start with the machines.

You left out mail-in voting. He would also blame teenage gangsters stealing ballots to ensure anti-Trump votes. So far in my neck of the woods, the only teenagers I have seen on a rampage are Trump supporters who drink until drunk and wave Trump maga flags.

Why blame SCOTUS? Remember how they installed Pres Bush? Floridians lost their right to vote. Count the votes, no matter how long it takes.

Why blame the Russians? Well he could if they don't give him enough resources. Even though Mr Trump has no acting chops, he would say in his best waterfront voice, " I coulda been a contender" if only the Russians had given me some dirt on Joe.

Voter suppression? Really???? Republicans are all about voter suppression and Democrats are all about allowing as many qualified people as possible the opportunity to vote.

So what you really meant was Mr Trump will say Democrats allowed dead people to vote, they allowed people to vote multiple times, they allowed illegals to votes, they allowed felons to vote, they allowed blacks to vote, they allowed etc etc.

And those are just the easy obvious ones. Shoot, Mr Trump may claim space aliens voted against him.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326227 - 05/30/20 08:50 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
Because they don't.
A bit rigid.

Yes both left and right however as PM Churchill putatively said, "Never let a good crisis go to waste". That you would believe these folks would not combine forces, despite philosophical differences, is a bit naive. As so many conservatives have said about ME terrorists, the friend of my etc etc.

Quote:
Bannon and his ilk is on the opposite side of the conservative spectrum from the Libertarians - they are Big State, Big Government, Nationalists.
Bannon is an interesting case study of what real conservatives are all about. They want to destroy the federal government in order to maintain a tighter grip on power. Mr Trump is the proverbial wet dream for conservatives. So there is great appeal for a deconstructed federal government from many quarters of conservative thinkers and even a greater appeal if they can maintain power forever, despite being a minority in modern America. It is more than clear to many liberals, the real agenda for conservatives is to maintain that death grip on power. Check Sen Mc Connell and Graham. Both have appealed to federal judges to step down now so very young politically motivated ultra conservatives can be appointed to the federal bench and serve for the next two generations. Can you imagine that for the next 40 years any law passed by a Democrat Congress would be struck down ... purely on political grounds.

Quote:
The Anarchists want to be rid of Washington. The Statists want to rule it.
What makes you think anarchist care what comes after?

Modern anarchism is so fragmented and having a wide variety of agendas and objectives, to simply said they are against government is disingenuous. Many of these in America would like to share the power which has been denied them for a variety of reasons.

The bottom line is opportunities abound in times of crisis and for any group to not act at this juncture would be derelict to their constituencies and goals.
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326230 - 05/30/20 09:12 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
O just found this ... a reporter who sees the strange brew

Quote:
So we’re seeing a strange alignment occurring by some groups who are anti-government on the right and therefore anti-police because they think the police are too oppressive to them, aligning themselves with people like Black Lives Matter and saying, ‘hey, we’re one because we both don’t like the police,’ but I’m here to tell you they are not one, their intention is to destroy government and the system of justice, as opposed to calling for justice within the system.


and if it gets any stranger, we'll have dogs and cats living together
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326241 - 05/31/20 07:39 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
Because they don't.
A bit rigid.


I'm speaking from experience, and, in this cases it follows logically: Anarchists don't support LE, and, as they are defined against the state having the coercive power to force you to take or not take particular actions, are ideologically not going to support LE.

Quote:
Yes both left and right however as PM Churchill putatively said, "Never let a good crisis go to waste". That you would believe these folks would not combine forces, despite philosophical differences, is a bit naive. As so many conservatives have said about ME terrorists, the friend of my etc etc.


I've spent pretty much my entire adult life dealing with the problem of terrorism.

Anarchist Libertarians and Statist Big Government advocates aren't going to ally to take down the State, not least because the latter doesn't want to, and the former hates the latter almost as much as the latter hates the former.

Quote:
Quote:
Bannon and his ilk is on the opposite side of the conservative spectrum from the Libertarians - they are Big State, Big Government, Nationalists.
Bannon is an interesting case study of what real conservatives are all about.


.....no. Bannon & co. is (at best) representative of an often-rejected branch that straddles concerns of both broad sides and which exists outside of what has generally been American Conservatism.

Quote:
They want to destroy the federal government in order to maintain a tighter grip on power.


Also no. They want to seize control of the Federal Government and expand it's power in order to steer more economic and social outcomes that they prefer.

Quote:
Mr Trump is the proverbial wet dream for conservatives.


Also no, which is why there was a groundswell of conservative opposition to Trump in the 2015 primary and 2016 election. There was no comparable NeverHillary movement on the left in 2016, nor a NeverBernie movement this year.

Quote:
So there is great appeal for a deconstructed federal government from many quarters of conservative thinkers and even a greater appeal if they can maintain power forever, despite being a minority in modern America. It is more than clear to many liberals, the real agenda for conservatives is to maintain that death grip on power. Check Sen Mc Connell and Graham.


You are confusing politicians with conservatives, however, yes, generally the purpose of political movements is to achieve their aims. To the extent that those conservatives who advocate abandoning conservative principles in the naked pursuit of power do so, they claim to be merely following suit vis-a-vie the opposition, in order to not be unfairly hampered.

Quote:
Both have appealed to federal judges to step down now so very young politically motivated ultra conservatives can be appointed to the federal bench and serve for the next two generations. Can you imagine that for the next 40 years any law passed by a Democrat Congress would be struck down ... purely on political grounds.


That would look very much like the last 3 and a half years, or so, with the sides reversed.

Quote:
The Anarchists want to be rid of Washington. The Statists want to rule it.
What makes you think anarchist care what comes after?[/quote]

The fact that that is the ideology's reason for existence.
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#326242 - 05/31/20 07:41 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
Do you think he'll blame Diebold voting machines, the SCOTUS, Russian Interference, or voter suppression?

For starters Mr Trump is a well known liar. He is a narcissist and is therefore compelled to lie to maintain his delusions he is the greatest human to have ever lived etc etc. So does it really matter which and how many scapegoats he uses to incite {{{{THE BASE}}}}.

Originally Posted By: Verified Voting Foundation, Inc.
Far too many states use unreliable and insecure electronic voting machines, and many states have made their situation worse by adding some forms of Internet voting for some voters, which cannot be checked for accuracy at all. Even in states where verifiable systems are used, too often the check on the voting system’s function and accuracy is not done. The voting equipment now in use are aging; resources are severely impacted by the state of the economy over the past several years; shortages of both equipment and human resources are likely. After all the effort necessary to overcome the other hurdles to casting a ballot, it is patently unfair that once you get to the ballot box, that the ballot itself fails you. Taken together, these problems threaten to silently disenfranchise voters, potentially in sufficient numbers to alter outcomes.

So clearly he would start with the machines.

You left out mail-in voting. He would also blame teenage gangsters stealing ballots to ensure anti-Trump votes. So far in my neck of the woods, the only teenagers I have seen on a rampage are Trump supporters who drink until drunk and wave Trump maga flags.

Why blame SCOTUS? Remember how they installed Pres Bush? Floridians lost their right to vote. Count the votes, no matter how long it takes.

Why blame the Russians? Well he could if they don't give him enough resources. Even though Mr Trump has no acting chops, he would say in his best waterfront voice, " I coulda been a contender" if only the Russians had given me some dirt on Joe.

Voter suppression? Really???? Republicans are all about voter suppression and Democrats are all about allowing as many qualified people as possible the opportunity to vote.

So what you really meant was Mr Trump will say Democrats allowed dead people to vote, they allowed people to vote multiple times, they allowed illegals to votes, they allowed felons to vote, they allowed blacks to vote, they allowed etc etc.

And those are just the easy obvious ones. Shoot, Mr Trump may claim space aliens voted against him.


Sorry. That may have been too obscure. Those were references to the different ways that Democrats have recently tried to claim that elections were fraudulent/stolen/etc.
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#326245 - 05/31/20 08:47 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Sorry. That may have been too obscure. Those were references to the different ways that Democrats have recently tried to claim that elections were fraudulent/stolen/etc.


1. Obviously, you haven't read, or choose not to read the Mueller Report
2. Obviously, you're not aware, or choose not to be aware of NC-09
3. The 2004 irregularities: Please, these are just three examples. rolleyes
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#326250 - 05/31/20 10:04 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
jgw Offline
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Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3462
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Years ago there was a big debate about voting machines. I thought it was quite simple. A rich guy, at least during that time, owned the voting machine business. His machines ran proprietary software which, apparently, is easily hacked to this day (there was a recent report of a high school kid doing it in about 20 minutes). Anyway, if memory serves, a group of programmers got together and offered software that was more responsible, worked better, kept track of things better, etc. That software was free. One would have thought, but, no, nothing ever came of that one and there are still these voting machines out there. I have never used one but understand thousands do. These machines can be easily hacked, have poor software which can blow, and, at the time, the guy who owned the company that made them was promising the Republicans to "bring the votes".

Nobody was ever sure what, exactly, he meant by that one but it changed absolutely nothing.

to my own mind voting machines should be gone. There is really no reason why they even exist as they don't help the process and have problems.

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#326274 - 06/01/20 03:19 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Sorry. That may have been too obscure. Those were references to the different ways that Democrats have recently tried to claim that elections were fraudulent/stolen/etc.


1. Obviously, you haven't read, or choose not to read the Mueller Report
2. Obviously, you're not aware, or choose not to be aware of NC-09
3. The 2004 irregularities: Please, these are just three examples. rolleyes



smile Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims, similarly supported, which I expect you will, of course, recognize the validity of smile
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#326277 - 06/01/20 04:57 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Gee I am so dense I did not recognize your oblique references to Democrat criticisms. Yes I guess all liberals are too dumb for a discussion with conservatives.

Mr Trump does not care about the source of his narcissistic rants nor his inability to accept reality. He will as I have typed simply turn it around and use for his own delusion.

That you failed to see that, may be the problem. Your failure to see the potential impact of derelict voting machines, intrusion of both the SC and Russians, and of course the active measures used by Republicans to disenfranchise (which BTW has been publicly confirmed by top Republican officials) potential Democrat voters is the real problem. I guess this is akin to the public denial that much of the Trump base is driven by bigotry (at least in my neck to the woods it is 100% true and valid).
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326279 - 06/01/20 05:16 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
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Yes I support Mr Trump's claims of rampant voter fraud.

The Heritage Foundation continues documenting the rampantness of this fraud (which BTW only documents Democrats) and has found some 1400 cases in 8 years from 2008 to 2016. Thus averaging the rampantness we find for 4 election cycles 7 cases of fraud per cycle per state. Definitely rampant .... plum outta control ... OMG ... what can we do to stop the rampantness?????

Gee even more concerning are some of the cases. Collecting ballots from older folks for delivery to post office ... yep that be a crime according to Republicans who prosecuted the cases. The cases for actual in person voter fraud (impersonation) was so far less as to be uncountable.

So do you support Mr Trump, and more broadly Republican, ridiculous claims of rampant voter fraud?

Quote:
I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims, similarly supported, which I expect you will, of course, recognize the validity
Should Republicans produce, and I really hope it would be local law enforcement, factual evidence, yes I support and recognize it.

The problem is Republicans routinely claim the ridiculous .... Mr Trump and his partisan gangs of voter thugs ... do you support that claim??? ... or how about rampant voter fraud and never supplying a shred of evidence (think caravans of MA voters voting in NH elections ... I saw the license plates!!!!) or how about millions of illegals voting ( I think I saw only a handful were caught) ... do you believe that????

But the problem is Republicans will claim .... yeah but those are only the ones who were caught ... millions were not caught ... all those dead folks .... crossing state lines .... illegals ... etc. So is that your evidence? the belief millions committed crimes but just weren't caught???? I wonder how that would hold up in court.

You got real evidence? the answer is yes!!!!!
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty
Get off the crazy train!!! ... dump Trump

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#326282 - 06/01/20 06:08 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee
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#326284 - 06/01/20 06:48 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee


smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile
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#326287 - 06/01/20 08:18 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee


smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile

Yet if you read the articles, if you can, the facts of the matter are quite different. smile
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#326288 - 06/01/20 09:50 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee


smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile

Yet if you read the articles, if you can, the facts of the matter are quite different. smile


Oh yes, of course. The OTHER guys are ALWAYS in conspiracies against goodness and freedom. That's why it's only legitimate when WE claim that our losing elections was illegitimate smile.
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#326290 - 06/01/20 09:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
danarhea Offline
stranger

Registered: 02/26/20
Posts: 47
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee


smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile



Well, let's look at who got busted for election fraud in the last election, and who did it. In 2018 there was one arrest in North Carolina, and one arrest in Arizona. Both arrested were Republicans. The North Carolina arrest was the most egregious. This was a Republican who harvested ballots in a Democratic neighborhood, then threw them all in the garbage.

Sure shoots down the claim that voter fraud is rampant. It isn't.


Edited by danarhea (06/01/20 09:57 PM)

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#326299 - 06/02/20 12:16 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: danarhea]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: danarhea
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Thank you. I am certain that Trump and his supporters after the 2020 election (should he lose) will have similar claims...

Someone doesn't have a firm grasp of the definition of claims. coffee


smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile

Well, let's look at who got busted for election fraud in the last election, and who did it. In 2018 there was one arrest in North Carolina, and one arrest in Arizona. Both arrested were Republicans. The North Carolina arrest was the most egregious. This was a Republican who harvested ballots in a Democratic neighborhood, then threw them all in the garbage.

Sure shoots down the claim that voter fraud is rampant. It isn't.

Oh c'mon danarhea, those are just claims of "claims." Just because the "claims" actually happened, doesn't mean what they claim to mean smile

On a serious note, every honest, decent person will admit that corruption and stealing elations is the Republican's bread and butter. coffee
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#326300 - 06/02/20 01:05 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Oh yes, of course. The OTHER guys are ALWAYS in conspiracies against goodness and freedom. That's why it's only legitimate when WE claim that our losing elections was illegitimate smile.

Weird how your "conspiracy theories" end you Righties in jail. smile
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#326304 - 06/02/20 04:20 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: danarhea]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: danarhea
Originally Posted By: CPWILL

smile Sure, PDX. BS claims of stolen elections that undercut public confidence in our electoral system are only bad when the other guy does it. smile



Well, let's look at who got busted for election fraud in the last election, and who did it. In 2018 there was one arrest in North Carolina, and one arrest in Arizona. Both arrested were Republicans. The North Carolina arrest was the most egregious. This was a Republican who harvested ballots in a Democratic neighborhood, then threw them all in the garbage.

Sure shoots down the claim that voter fraud is rampant. It isn't.


That is impossible. I have been assured that the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were all stolen laugh


Edited by CPWILL (06/02/20 04:20 PM)
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#326306 - 06/02/20 04:40 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17062
Loc: Florida
None of those elections were "stolen". They were close races that really should have gone the other way so there was a bit of outrage.

I'm sure you were completely satisfied with the results, CP, because they favored your chosen ideology. An ideology, I might add, that has gotten us where we are today.

The same ideology espoused by the gun toting window breaking arrow shooting fire starting and looting Boogaloo Bois.

Riots in the streets are just a part of the human condition. Like poverty and disease. some must suffer so that wealthy can have more than they need.
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#326309 - 06/02/20 04:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Quote:
I have been assured that the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were all stolen
who exactly assured you??? I am really curious.

Despite the fact Candidate Bush would have won the 2000 election anyway the SC should not have intervened in the counting process.

The 2016 results were heavily influenced by Russians and Dir Comey.

I think when people use the term "stolen election" they mean actual real fraudulent voting (which changes the outcome), stealing ballots boxes, machines changing votes, etc. You will also notice for any of that to be really meaningful it has to be rampant in the real sense of an actual dictionary i.e. " flourishing or spreading unchecked", and not in Republicans use of word rampant meaning 7 cases per state. Now if you know of anything like that happening in 2000, 2004, or 2016, then not only do I want to know about it but I think law enforcement would like your evidence .... otherwise nothing was stolen.
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#326315 - 06/02/20 05:36 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
I have been assured that the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were all stolen
who exactly assured you??? I am really curious.

Despite the fact Candidate Bush would have won the 2000 election anyway the SC should not have intervened in the counting process.

The 2016 results were heavily influenced by Russians and Dir Comey.

I think when people use the term "stolen election" they mean actual real fraudulent voting (which changes the outcome), stealing ballots boxes, machines changing votes, etc. You will also notice for any of that to be really meaningful it has to be rampant in the real sense of an actual dictionary i.e. " flourishing or spreading unchecked", and not in Republicans use of word rampant meaning 7 cases per state. Now if you know of anything like that happening in 2000, 2004, or 2016, then not only do I want to know about it but I think law enforcement would like your evidence .... otherwise nothing was stolen.


smile They should talk to PDX, I suppose, then smile Because:


Quote:
I think when people use the term "stolen election" they mean actual real fraudulent voting (which changes the outcome), stealing ballots boxes, machines changing votes, etc.


is a description that fits the Diebold conspiracy theory pretty well.
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#326317 - 06/02/20 05:59 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17062
Loc: Florida
Quote:
the Diebold conspiracy theory


Has there ever been a single example of this proven? I aint gonna Google it because I doubt it. And like other stuff, so rare as to affect nothing.

Our voting system needs a complete overhaul.
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#326319 - 06/02/20 06:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3462
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I did google "the Diebold conspiracy theory" and got a pile of pretty interesting stuff. Here is one (not sure its true or not):
http://thetruthwins.com/archives/20-conspiracy-theories-that-turned-out-to-be-true

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#326321 - 06/02/20 07:49 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: Greger
None of those elections were "stolen". They were close races that really should have gone the other way so there was a bit of outrage.


They were races that people wanted to go the other way, and, they allowed that emotional response to pull them into the same kind of conspiracy nonsense that is being pre-emptively criticized (and rightfully, if he does so) in Trump.



Undermining confidence in our elections is somehow only bad when the other guy does it. Convenient, that.



Quote:
I'm sure you were completely satisfied with the results, CP, because they favored your chosen ideology. An ideology, I might add, that has gotten us where we are today.


Wealthiest, most powerful, nation on a globe with a standard of living unmatched in human history and an imperfect but generally steady and increasing protection of individual liberties?

Fair enough. I'll take that hit. laugh

Quote:
The same ideology espoused by the gun toting window breaking arrow shooting fire starting and looting Boogaloo Bois.


No, for two reasons:

1. Those Rebel Cosplay idiots tend not to have much of a ideology at all and, to the extent that they do, it is often a weird and poorly thought out mix of pro-trump-troll ism and

2. It generally isn't the Boogie bois out there lighting fires and breaking into stores. That's more your antifa types. For all their bluster, the Bois don't actually go toe-to-toe with the police.

Quote:
Riots in the streets are just a part of the human condition. Like poverty and disease. some must suffer so that wealthy can have more than they need.


Nah - destruction is just destruction. Riots harm the communities they take place in, destroy savings and investments, and raise the cost of future business in the area. With the exception, I suppose, of those who take advantage of the chaos to make off with a new television, pretty much everyone is hurt in riots.


Edited by CPWILL (06/02/20 07:50 PM)
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#326322 - 06/02/20 07:51 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
the Diebold conspiracy theory


Has there ever been a single example of this proven? I aint gonna Google it because I doubt it. And like other stuff, so rare as to affect nothing.

Our voting system needs a complete overhaul.



laugh Agree. Service Guarantees Citizenship laugh


Edited by CPWILL (06/02/20 07:51 PM)
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#326325 - 06/02/20 09:10 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
That is impossible. I have been assured that the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were all stolen laugh

Supports ^^^ the last vestige of slavery. coffee
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#326326 - 06/02/20 09:12 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: rporter314
Quote:
I have been assured that the 2000, 2004, and 2016 Presidential elections were all stolen
who exactly assured you??? I am really curious.

Despite the fact Candidate Bush would have won the 2000 election anyway the SC should not have intervened in the counting process.

The 2016 results were heavily influenced by Russians and Dir Comey.

I think when people use the term "stolen election" they mean actual real fraudulent voting (which changes the outcome), stealing ballots boxes, machines changing votes, etc. You will also notice for any of that to be really meaningful it has to be rampant in the real sense of an actual dictionary i.e. " flourishing or spreading unchecked", and not in Republicans use of word rampant meaning 7 cases per state. Now if you know of anything like that happening in 2000, 2004, or 2016, then not only do I want to know about it but I think law enforcement would like your evidence .... otherwise nothing was stolen.


smile They should talk to PDX, I suppose, then smile Because:


Quote:
I think when people use the term "stolen election" they mean actual real fraudulent voting (which changes the outcome), stealing ballots boxes, machines changing votes, etc.


is a description that fits the Diebold conspiracy theory pretty well.

Except the Diebold machine fckups are not conspiracies. Someone doesn't understand facts from conspiracies.

Hmm
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#326328 - 06/03/20 02:45 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17062
Loc: Florida
What Diebold machine f*ckups? Is there any real convincing proof that voting machine results have been tampered with? Any convictions? Or are we just sure it has to be happening because the internet.

I like the idea of mail in paper ballots. Millions and millions of machines dragged to all the precincts and set up for a few days then hauled back to warehouses to sit for two years seems a bit frivolous to me. What's the point of voting machines in the first place? Counting machines are much simpler.
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#326329 - 06/03/20 03:08 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Greger
What Diebold machine f*ckups? Is there any real convincing proof that voting machine results have been tampered with? Any convictions?

Page 3, post 2 of this thread. smile

I beginning to think that I post links around here just for sh!ts and giggles. coffee
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#326330 - 06/03/20 03:12 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: jgw]
rporter314 Offline
veteran

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
I don't know about interesting since the writer is a nut.
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#326342 - 06/03/20 05:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Greger Online   content


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17062
Loc: Florida
Quote:
Wealthiest, most powerful, nation on a globe with a standard of living unmatched in human history and an imperfect but generally steady and increasing protection of individual liberties?

Fair enough. I'll take that hit. laugh


Have you asked George Floyd about the protection of his individual liberties?

If he was alive to answer he might disagree. But if you ask the wealthy and powerful you find them all on your side. They are none of my concern. They'll get along fine. The boog bois are cowards. Did you see the one shooting arrows into the crowd? They won't go toe to toe with anyone because they are pussies. But they want the same things you do. And the one breaking windows with a hammer? He ran away.

Did you see the cops pushing down the old white man? They're Boog Boi cosplayers too. Respect Ma Authoratah! A cosplay that comes with a license to kill.

These are your people CP.

I see everything through a Marxist lens, y'know? You are on the side of the king or you are not.

It's not a bad thing to be a bougie and I'm fairly certain it's genetic.

Societies always draw themselves up into two factions. White people vs POCs, Republicans vs Democrats, Christians vs All Other Faiths. Tories vs Labour, Bougies vs Proles.

The Haves, and the Have nots. The right and the left.

You, CP, sit at the right hand of the king, and I sit on the left.

I'm convinced that the Big Bang was the culmination of the eternal class struggle in another Universe and our concept of The Tetragrammaton, is the leader of one of the factions whose spirit got sucked through into this universe as his own was being destroyed. An Elder God in the Lovecraftian sense.

What were we talking about anyway...
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#326345 - 06/03/20 06:18 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10139
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
Millions and millions of machines dragged to all the precincts and set up for a few days then hauled back to warehouses to sit for two years seems a bit frivolous to me.


It's actually MUCH worse than that: Every single one of those machines has to be programmed correctly for the districts they will end up in. It requires a huge amount of IT-like physical work. Instead of workers just sitting at their computers specifying the ballots for each district, and then sending the info to the printers. That whole paper ballot process is highly automated. Delivery of paper ballots is done by truck drivers.

Programming voting machines is not. Somebody has to specify the ballots, and then manually hook each machine up to a computer, select the right district's ballot, download the code, then test the machine to make sure it works, has the right ballot, uploads the right totals, and then transport it to the right polling place, hook it up, and then test it again.

Any savings in printing costs is far outweighed by the cost of the people who have to support the machines.

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#326466 - 06/09/20 08:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL

Wealthiest, most powerful, nation on a globe with a standard of living unmatched in human history



Norway and New Zealand would like a word.

Quote:
and an imperfect but generally steady and increasing protection of individual liberties?


Eric Garner and George Floyd would like a word.
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#326467 - 06/09/20 08:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
the Diebold conspiracy theory


Has there ever been a single example of this proven? I aint gonna Google it because I doubt it. And like other stuff, so rare as to affect nothing.

Our voting system needs a complete overhaul.



laugh Agree. Service Guarantees Citizenship laugh


Our cult of the military is bad enough already.
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#326468 - 06/09/20 08:44 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
Hamish Howl Offline
journeyman

Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176
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#326469 - 06/09/20 10:27 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Greger]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quote:
Wealthiest, most powerful, nation on a globe with a standard of living unmatched in human history and an imperfect but generally steady and increasing protection of individual liberties?

Fair enough. I'll take that hit. laugh


Have you asked George Floyd about the protection of his individual liberties?


I don't know. Have you spent much time discussing it with the Uighurs?

The perfect is not a proper enemy of the good - nor does the existence of abuse make what I wrote untrue.


Quote:
If he was alive to answer he might disagree. But if you ask the wealthy and powerful you find them all on your side. They are none of my concern. They'll get along fine. The boog bois are cowards. Did you see the one shooting arrows into the crowd? They won't go toe to toe with anyone because they are pussies. But they want the same things you do.


A law forbidding used car salesmen from making their own television commercials?

Quote:
Did you see the cops pushing down the old white man? They're Boog Boi cosplayers too. Respect Ma Authoratah! A cosplay that comes with a license to kill.

These are your people CP.

I see everything through a Marxist lens, y'know?


Yeah. So does the CCP. So did Lenin. So did Castro, and so do and did the host of cruel tyrants below them all who trampled tens of millions of George Floyds into the mud. You want to talk incredibly repressive and abusive governments who have horrific human rights records and care not whether they trample on those they rule? TheDictatorship by those who claim to speak on behalf of the proletariat? That would be your people. wink

Quote:
I'm convinced that the Big Bang was the culmination of the eternal class struggle in another Universe and our concept of The Tetragrammaton, is the leader of one of the factions whose spirit got sucked through into this universe as his own was being destroyed. An Elder God in the Lovecraftian sense.

What were we talking about anyway...


laugh I'm convinced that some artificial substances have played no small role in the development of that idea laugh
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#326470 - 06/09/20 10:30 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Have you spent much time discussing it with the Uighurs?

Because being oppressed by a government (China in this case) solely because of your religion is the same as being oppressed by racist white ignorant American individuals because of the color of your skin.

I think that's called a false-equivalency. Your mileage may vary. coffee
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#326471 - 06/09/20 10:32 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL

Wealthiest, most powerful, nation on a globe with a standard of living unmatched in human history


Norway and New Zealand would like a word.


They're welcome to have it.

Quote:
Quote:
and an imperfect but generally steady and increasing protection of individual liberties?


Eric Garner and George Floyd would like a word.


Same answer to you as the answer above to Gregor (shrug). The perfect is not the enemy of the good, nor does the existence of abuses make what I wrote untrue. Even when you criticize Western Civilization, you depend upon it's own moral code to do so. I will happily take it over the alternatives.
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#326472 - 06/09/20 10:33 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Have you spent much time discussing it with the Uighurs?

Because being oppressed by a government (China in this case) solely because of your religion is the same as being oppressed by racist white ignorant American individuals because of the color of your skin.

I think that's called a false-equivalency. Your mileage may vary. coffee


smile It's not intended to be considered equivalent. What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point.
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#326473 - 06/09/20 10:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176

Careful, someone might try to discount that fact as a "claim."

rolleyes, Hmm, coffee
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#326474 - 06/09/20 10:52 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA


Wait! What?!? :doh:

Originally Posted By: CPWILL
It's not intended to be considered equivalent.


Originally Posted By: CPWILL
What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point.

You just made it an equivalency. LOL
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#326478 - 06/10/20 12:59 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
newbie

Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick


Wait! What?!? :doh:

Originally Posted By: CPWILL
It's not intended to be considered equivalent.


Originally Posted By: CPWILL
What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point.

You just made it an equivalency. LOL



...No. To put forth an equivalency is to ascribe at least rough equality. I was making precisely the opposite point - that the two are nowhere near equal.


Edited by CPWILL (06/10/20 12:59 AM)
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#326480 - 06/10/20 01:03 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...No. To put forth an equivalency is to ascribe at least rough equality. I was making precisely the opposite point - that the two are nowhere near equal.

Your pseudo-intellectually is completely laughable. Try learning what words mean before you try to opine in public discussions. Just a thought. smile
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#326488 - 06/10/20 05:58 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...No. To put forth an equivalency is to ascribe at least rough equality. I was making precisely the opposite point - that the two are nowhere near equal.

Your pseudo-intellectually is completely laughable. Try learning what words mean before you try to opine in public discussions. Just a thought. smile


laugh Irony Much? smile

Equivalence: The state or condition of being equivalent; equality.
the state of being equivalent or interchangeable
the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.


As I said - to put forth an equivalency is to claim that two items are roughly equal in the matter being discussed. I not only didn't do that, the point that the two were not equivalent was precisely the one I was making.


Edited by CPWILL (06/10/20 05:59 PM)
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#326497 - 06/10/20 07:26 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Looking at the list of people charged with federal crimes in response to the unrest, most of the charges that will stick are for extreme righties making bombs and such. I was surprised. Yet another Trump initiative that backfires.

But the truth is that people protesting police brutality are unlikely to use violence themselves. And the people with all those guns are almost always right-wing extremists, just itching for an opportunity to use them.

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#326500 - 06/10/20 07:53 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
laugh Irony Much? smile

Equivalence: The state or condition of being equivalent; equality.
the state of being equivalent or interchangeable
the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.


As I said - to put forth an equivalency is to claim that two items are roughly equal in the matter being discussed. I not only didn't do that, the point that the two were not equivalent was precisely the one I was making.


Originally Posted By: CPWILL
What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point.


Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Your pseudo-intellectually is completely laughable. Try learning what words mean before you try to opine in public discussions. Just a thought. smile


How can something be "more or worse?" Was that a clever attempt to state "more or less?" I stand by my post. smile
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#326509 - 06/11/20 02:27 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Equivalence: The state or condition of being equivalent; equality.
the state of being equivalent or interchangeable
the state or fact of being equivalent; equality in value, force, significance, etc.


As I said - to put forth an equivalency is to claim that two items are roughly equal in the matter being discussed. I not only didn't do that, the point that the two were not equivalent was precisely the one I was making.

Originally Posted By: CPWILL
What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point.

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Your pseudo-intellectually is completely laughable. Try learning what words mean before you try to opine in public discussions. Just a thought. smile

How can something be "more or worse?" Was that a clever attempt to state "more or less?" I stand by my post. smile



Ah. You have a reading comprehension issue. No worries smile

Here is the quote:

Originally Posted By: cpwill
"What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point."


Do you know what's not in there? The phrase "more or worse", which, due to your confusion, you thought might mean "more or less". Instead (here, I'll bold the relevant section for you):

Originally Posted By: cpwill
"What is happening to the Uighurs is an order of magnitude or more worse than what African Americans face in this country today. That was the point."


So the phrase "more or worse" does not (as you claimed) appear in that section, but, rather, instead, the term "or more" is used in reference to "an order of magnitude". This quote makes the claim that what is happening is either:

A. An order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today

or

B. More than an order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today.

Personally I would lean heavily in favor of the latter option being more likely, but, in neither instance does it suggest an equivalency.


Interestingly enough, even if the phrase had been "an order of magnitude more or worse", it still would not have claimed an equivalency, and would, instead have only suggested Options A and B above. wink


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 02:30 PM)
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#326511 - 06/11/20 02:32 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
Looking at the list of people charged with federal crimes in response to the unrest, most of the charges that will stick are for extreme righties making bombs and such. I was surprised. Yet another Trump initiative that backfires.


.....how is that a backfire? Surely you are not so sunk into tribalism that you would regret the arrest and prosecution of those who would engage in reckless violence if they happened to be left-leaning?
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#326512 - 06/11/20 02:46 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
.....how is that a backfire? Surely you are not so sunk into tribalism that you would regret the arrest and prosecution of those who would engage in reckless violence if they happened to be left-leaning?

It's so simple when you have a crystal ball that tells you who is leaning which way!
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#326513 - 06/11/20 02:51 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Ah. You have a reading comprehension issue. No worries smile

Gotta love them non-ad hominem pokes!

I think the issue is not equivalencies, but false or irrelevant equivalencies that are useless for a real discussion of anything, i.e. a distraction.
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#326514 - 06/11/20 03:01 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
Hamish Howl Offline
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Registered: 11/21/19
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So let me get this straight: We can not or should not improve our relationship with American black folks (ie, stop killing them) because the Uighurs have it worse?
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#326517 - 06/11/20 03:08 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176


Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push...


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 03:12 PM)
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#326519 - 06/11/20 03:10 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
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Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
So let me get this straight: We can not or should not improve our relationship with American black folks (ie, stop killing them) because the Uighurs have it worse?


No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving


Whether or not the Chinese government is currently engaging in a form of genocide should have no bearing on whether or not or how we choose to address issues in this country, except that it should offer us a cautionary tale against the horror that can come when you define, dehumanize, and deride people based on their ethnicity.


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 03:11 PM)
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#326520 - 06/11/20 03:15 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
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Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
So let me get this straight: We can not or should not improve our relationship with American black folks (ie, stop killing them) because the Uighurs have it worse?


No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving


Whether or not the Chinese government is currently engaging in a form of genocide should have no bearing on whether or not or how we choose to address issues in this country, except that it should offer us a cautionary tale against the horror that can come when you define, dehumanize, and deride people based on their ethnicity.



"Better" in this case is not good enough, and I really can't improve on MLK's reply to 'be patient, things are improving'."

I don't care if we're better than China. China is not even relevant to the situation here. The situation here is unacceptable and has to change, whether or not that change is accepted by our government and/or the so-called "silent majority".
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#326521 - 06/11/20 03:16 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
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Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176


Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push...


Who determines the voting rules and methodology in a state?
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#326524 - 06/11/20 03:31 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
logtroll Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
So let me get this straight: We can not or should not improve our relationship with American black folks (ie, stop killing them) because the Uighurs have it worse?


No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is stillA) better than the alternatives and
B) improving
Whether or not the Chinese government is currently engaging in a form of genocide should have no bearing on whether or not or how we choose to address issues in this country, except that it should offer us a cautionary tale against the horror that can come when you define, dehumanize, and deride people based on their ethnicity.

"Better" in this case is not good enough, and I really can't improve on MLK's reply to 'be patient, things are improving'."

I don't care if we're better than China. China is not even relevant to the situation here. The situation here is unacceptable and has to change, whether or not that change is accepted by our government and/or the so-called "silent majority".

It could be that neither the Uighurs nor the African-Americans are making good choices. They could simply choose to live better? I mean, it's a free market out there, ain't it?
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#326526 - 06/11/20 04:02 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
"Better" in this case is not good enough, and I really can't improve on MLK's reply to 'be patient, things are improving'."


We live in a broken world that will never be "good enough" while we live here - at best it can only become less bad. What we have achieved here in this country is amazingly less bad than what we as a species have historically achieved, and what other societies have achieved around the world. I concur there are definitely things we can reform in this country that would move us in a less-bad direction - reform of public sector unions, which protect their bad actors from accountability comes to mind, as does changing Qualified Immunity to a Reasonable Man standard. That, however, doesn't make me not-thankful for what we have.

Quote:
I don't care if we're better than China.


Then don't respond to a conversation about that. smile


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 04:04 PM)
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#326527 - 06/11/20 04:02 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: logtroll]
CPWILL Offline
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Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: logtroll
It could be that neither the Uighurs nor the African-Americans are making good choices. They could simply choose to live better? I mean, it's a free market out there, ain't it?


In China?


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 04:03 PM)
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#326528 - 06/11/20 04:05 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176


Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push...


Who determines the voting rules and methodology in a state?


smile Who runs the voting sites that are having the problems you are complaining about?
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#326529 - 06/11/20 04:09 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: logtroll
It could be that neither the Uighurs nor the African-Americans are making good choices. They could simply choose to live better? I mean, it's a free market out there, ain't it?

In China?

Dang it, yer right... they just need a lot more government protections and regulation, like we've got!

Simple.
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#326534 - 06/11/20 05:58 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: logtroll]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
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Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: logtroll
It could be that neither the Uighurs nor the African-Americans are making good choices. They could simply choose to live better? I mean, it's a free market out there, ain't it?

In China?

Dang it, yer right... they just need a lot more government protections and regulation, like we've got!

Simple.


*snorts*

Yeah. If only China had a big, overbearing government, the incidents of human rights abuses by that government would surely go down. Surely, right?
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#326537 - 06/11/20 06:13 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
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2 cents and something on which to cogitate

In mathematics there is something known as the axiom of choice. It is one of the major ideas which enable higher mathematics to be created. Turns out there are ( to best of my recollection) some 21 different equivalent statements in mathematics to the simple statement of the axiom. Think about that .... 21 different statements which are equivalent ... and some of them are so abstract and esoteric as to make one believe they have no bearing on the axiom ... but they do ... as they can be proven to be equivalent.

Quote:
Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push

That statement is the equivalent to ... counties which are run by white folks are competent.

think mathematics and enjoy your broad minded contemplation
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#326538 - 06/11/20 06:46 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10284
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: logtroll
It could be that neither the Uighurs nor the African-Americans are making good choices. They could simply choose to live better? I mean, it's a free market out there, ain't it?

In China?

Dang it, yer right... they just need a lot more government protections and regulation, like we've got!

Simple.

Yeah. If only China had a big, overbearing government, the incidents of human rights abuses by that government would surely go down. Surely, right?

How do you get "big, overbearing..." from "...protections and regulations..."?

Might be more than a bit of anti-government prejudice in that free-market Capitalism ideology of yourn. FMC would die in two heartbeats without the socialism of government protections and regulation, which means that it is basically a delusional myth. Don't you agree, expert reviewer?
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#326539 - 06/11/20 07:49 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
... the term "or more" is used in reference to "an order of magnitude". This quote makes the claim that what is happening is either:

A. An order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today

or

B. More than an order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today.

Of course a white nationalist would claim that the bigotry, racism, and criminal injustice experienced by black Americans and their families for 400 years pales in comparison to more recent bigotry and atrocities experienced globally by other minorities - and in particular, the Muslim Uighurs by the Chinese Government.

Thank you for clearing that up. You people just can't help yourself. smile

You're probably pissed as well, that there will be no more Confederate flags at NASCAR and that Lady Annebellum changed their name to Lady A. coffee
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#326540 - 06/11/20 07:53 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
So let me get this straight: We can not or should not improve our relationship with American black folks (ie, stop killing them) because the Uighurs have it worse?

I know, right? crazy
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#326541 - 06/11/20 07:58 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
It's just amazing how all the voting machine problems just happen to occur in largely black areas.

https://apnews.com/e7ea6e919fadb995c407eea3a4450176


Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push...

Let's take Georgia's recent fckup as an example.

In the state of Georgia, the Secretary of State is the election superintendent. It is in the Georgia Constitution that the Secretary of State's responsibility to direct, train and oversee the conduct of Georgia's elections. Georgia allows counties to do the direct implementation, but it’s the responsibility of the Secretary of State to remedy any problems, the Secretary of State in Georgia should have the resources and responsibility to ensure elections run smoothly.
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#326542 - 06/11/20 08:02 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving

How is life improving for the Black American? Your white nationalist talking points are pathetic. Hmm
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#326546 - 06/11/20 09:46 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving

How is life improving for the Black American?


Well, the statement was for our society as a whole, but, sure, we can absolutely point to improvements in the lives of Black Americans. Take any Civil Rights leader from the 1960s, put them in a time machine to today, and ask them which era is better off for African Americans. Take anyone dealing with the spike in violent crime in the 1980s, shift them into the future of today, and ask them in which one African Americans are less likely to die a violent death. Until COVID, unemployment was at historic lows among the African American community and more African Americans than ever were attending and completing college and inhabiting the middle class (though not really an improvement in our ability to protect the individual rights of our people, they are measurements of conditions). Even as racism has decreased across the decades, awareness of it as a problem has increased.

Don't let the failure of the eschaton to immanentize blind you to ongoing improvements smile


Quote:
Your white nationalist talking points are pathetic. Hmm


:shrug: your pathetic (and foolish) bigotry is transparent. I'm as much a white nationalist as (I assume) you are a child rapist.
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#326547 - 06/11/20 09:49 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
... the term "or more" is used in reference to "an order of magnitude". This quote makes the claim that what is happening is either:

A. An order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today

or

B. More than an order of magnitude worse than what African Americans face in this country today.

Of course a white nationalist would claim that the bigotry, racism, and criminal injustice experienced by black Americans and their families for 400 years pales in comparison to more recent bigotry and atrocities experienced globally by other minorities - and in particular, the Muslim Uighurs by the Chinese Government.


What a fascinating response from someone who just spent their time trying to snidely (and incorrectly) suggest that others are stupid because you didn't understand the meaning of words.

Tell me, PDX. What does the word "today" mean, in your world?

smile


Quote:
You're probably pissed as well, that there will be no more Confederate flags at NASCAR


Not really. As a Marine, I also supported the Commandant's decision to ban that flag from our installations. smile


Edited by CPWILL (06/11/20 09:50 PM)
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#326548 - 06/11/20 09:54 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: logtroll]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: logtroll
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Yeah. If only China had a big, overbearing government, the incidents of human rights abuses by that government would surely go down. Surely, right?

How do you get "big, overbearing..." from "...protections and regulations..."?

Might be more than a bit of anti-government prejudice in that free-market Capitalism ideology of yourn. FMC would die in two heartbeats without the socialism of government protections and regulation, which means that it is basically a delusional myth. Don't you agree, expert reviewer?


I think you are confusing "the existence of regulation" with "it's expansion". Capitalism requires a state in order to function as, for example, does every other economic basis for organization other than your most basic Barter-based societies.

China's human rights abuses do not stem from not having enough government - it's that they have too much.
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#326549 - 06/11/20 09:56 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: rporter314
2 cents and something on which to cogitate

In mathematics there is something known as the axiom of choice. It is one of the major ideas which enable higher mathematics to be created. Turns out there are ( to best of my recollection) some 21 different equivalent statements in mathematics to the simple statement of the axiom. Think about that .... 21 different statements which are equivalent ... and some of them are so abstract and esoteric as to make one believe they have no bearing on the axiom ... but they do ... as they can be proven to be equivalent.

Quote:
Given that those machines and sites are generally run by the County Governments, I'm not sure that's a narrative you want to push

That statement is the equivalent to ... counties which are run by white folks are competent.


We have plenty of Hispanic-dominated counties as well (though I suppose plenty of folks lump them in with "white"), but, yes, that's why I'm not sure he wants to run around arguing that black-dominated county governments are always the ones to fail at competently holding elections.
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#326557 - 06/12/20 01:39 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
Member
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving

How is life improving for the Black American?


Well, the statement was for our society as a whole...

The only group whose lives are improving in America are the 1% who are generally white, followed by non-1% white males.

Your talking points are such a white nationalist stereotype. crazy
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#326558 - 06/12/20 03:11 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 7240
Loc: Highlands, Tx
hmmm .... "What we've got here is failure to communicate".

Mr Howl was not suggesting the problem was at the county level but at the GOP state level. The GOP run state failed to mail out enough ballots, causing people to show up in person at GOP state limited polling stations.

Your response was the rather narrow minded limited standard conservative response that it is the black run counties problem.

So when you typed it was those peoples fault, implying they were incompetent, .... now see if you can figure out the rest without any help
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#326559 - 06/12/20 05:16 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Tell me, PDX. What does the word "today" mean, in your world?

smile

You white nationalists always want to change the conversation and ignore the history of black suppression and injustice in America. That's just what you people do.

Hmm
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#326560 - 06/12/20 06:34 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...your pathetic (and foolish) bigotry is transparent. I'm as much a white nationalist as (I assume) you are a child rapist.

Because white nationalists like you think that ALL gays are child rapists. Indeed, i don't hide my complete and utter distain and contempt for Conservatives. I just don't. If that's bigotry, then so be it. smile
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#326564 - 06/12/20 03:20 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
No. The point was that, despite continued abuses that exist in our country, this Liberal, individual-rights-oriented Western society of ours is still

A) better than the alternatives and
B) improving

How is life improving for the Black American?


Well, the statement was for our society as a whole...

The only group whose lives are improving in America are the 1% who are generally white, followed by non-1% white males.


:shrug: This is false, as demonstrated by nothing better than the fact that you had to carefully edit out the rest of my post in order to avoid having to deal with other improvements.

Quote:
Your talking points are such a white nationalist stereotype. crazy


:shrug: foolish assignation of that term to anyone the left disagrees with immunized Trump to the accusation. You can only cry wolf so many times before you stop getting taken seriously, even when there actually is a wolf. So, I hope you like Trump - that's how you get more of him.


Edited by CPWILL (06/12/20 03:21 PM)
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#326565 - 06/12/20 03:22 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
...your pathetic (and foolish) bigotry is transparent. I'm as much a white nationalist as (I assume) you are a child rapist.

Because white nationalists like you think that ALL gays are child rapists.


....yeah. No. Cretins like Milo Yiannopoulos may be nationalists, but they are definitely not of the opinion that all gays are child rapists, nor, for that matter, is any nationalist of any stripe that I've ever heard write or speak on the matter.

So, once again, it seems, you have no idea what you are talking about when you discuss people who aren't like you.


Quote:
Indeed, i don't hide my complete and utter distain and contempt for Conservatives. I just don't. If that's bigotry, then so be it. smile


Fair enough. You proudly claim the intellectual credibility of a racist, sexist, or any other bigot. Well done.


Edited by CPWILL (06/12/20 03:36 PM)
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#326566 - 06/12/20 03:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: rporter314]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: rporter314
hmmm .... "What we've got here is failure to communicate".

Mr Howl was not suggesting the problem was at the county level but at the GOP state level.


Yes. People tend to work up through the different layers of government until they reach one currently populated by members of the party they don't like and - magically - come to the conclusion that it is that level of government responsible for a mishap. The Minneapolis police department can't be the fault of decades of local Democrat rule, despite the fact that it is the local government that actually makes decisions regarding it's police forces... and the state is Democrat... so.... gotta be Trump. The county government is Democrat, so, it can't be held responsible for the fact that it screwed up....so....next level is State... which is GOP.... AHA! Check!.

Except, of course, that all that is BS. In reality, Trump is responsible for what he does and fails to do. The county is responsible for what it does and fails to do. So, yes, if he's going to argue that "only black county's can't pull off elections", then he's making an argument that in reality is a judgment against African American dominated local governments.
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#326567 - 06/12/20 03:39 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
Hamish Howl Offline
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Registered: 11/21/19
Posts: 608
Loc: Tucson, AZ
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
So, yes, if he's going to argue that "only black county's can't pull off elections", then he's making an argument that in reality is a judgment against African American dominated local governments.


Do you agree with that argument?
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#326572 - 06/12/20 04:29 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
rporter314 Offline
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Registered: 03/18/03
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wow ... I am almost impressed with your creative dissemblance, but for the fact it is standard right wing sophistry.

Having listened to right wing radio hacks for years, I can recognize their shtick. The article cited actually presented both sides of the GA situation. It describes problems at the local level and detailed the states response to those problems. You as a conservative immediately assumed states response was the correct one. I on the other hand see far more in the local problems than you would ever entertain.

It is well known Republicans have for years been trying to disenfranchise groups which are potentially Democrat voters, and when a few thousand votes may determine an election, it is important to Republicans to keep those potential Democrat voters from voting. Thus when the local problems are listed and it is well known ( I guess to everyone but conservatives) the state makes determinations regarding voting stations and mail out ballots, I have to wonder, is the state lying about their responsibilities? You didn't even question that possibility. I would have thought an open minded individual trying to be objective would have done that ... but maybe I am wrong. Maybe conservatives don't want to know the facts, Maybe they don't care what the facts are. Maybe they just want to maintain power at the expense of democracy.

Quote:
In reality, Trump is responsible for what he does and fails to do.
ROFLMAO

I don;t know if that was willful ignorant, just plain old ignorant, or some lame attempt at disingenuousness. Regardless here is the clue .... the buck does not stop with Mr Trump ... he is not responsibile for anything.

Quote:
if he's going to argue that "only black county's can't pull off elections"
You have a comprehension problem unless you don't care if you have one.

The argument is ... now pay attention ... the state intentionally manufactured a process intent on failure (or to say it another way .... disenfranchisement). The state failed to mail out ballots. Counties don't do that. The state determined a limited number of polling stations. Counties do not do that. The state did this in only the counties which have high Democrat voters or potential turnout. Can you imagine what would have happened had the state done the same in a high density Republican county???

Now since I am a narrow minded liberal and only take my positional cues from G Soros, Sec Clinton, lets see ... who else do conservatives hate ... well whoever they are, I don't know if the states actions could have been over come, I don't know if the states actions were a part of the standard Republican disenfranchisement campaign, in fact I don't have but one conclusion and it is an opinion because I don;t have the facts ... the actions of the state are suspicious. How about and after voting report of the GA debacle to find out what really happened and how to fix the problems.

How about that???
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#326581 - 06/13/20 05:09 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Fair enough. You proudly claim the intellectual credibility of a racist, sexist, or any other bigot. Well done.

Takes one to know one. At least I don't loathe black Americans as you do - I only loathe white Conservatives and their Uncle Tom tokens like Zirconia and Burlap and that idiot savant Ben Carson.

smile
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#326584 - 06/13/20 05:52 AM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pdx rick Offline
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The Party of Lincoln is now the party of cryin’ NAZIs, white supremacists, police brutality enthusiasts, anti-semites, child creepers, sexual harassers, vote suppressors, bigots, science deniers, nutball conspiracy theorists, big fat orange liars and assorted criminals of all stripes.

That's what happens when conservatives infest a political party. Hmm
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#326586 - 06/13/20 03:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: Hamish Howl]
CPWILL Offline
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Originally Posted By: Hamish Howl
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
So, yes, if he's going to argue that "only black county's can't pull off elections", then he's making an argument that in reality is a judgment against African American dominated local governments.


Do you agree with that argument?


Nope - I disagree with your premise. Plenty of places have ***'d Up elections.
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#326587 - 06/13/20 03:36 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
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Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Fair enough. You proudly claim the intellectual credibility of a racist, sexist, or any other bigot. Well done.

Takes one to know one. At least I don't loathe black Americans as you do - I only loathe white Conservatives and their Uncle Tom tokens like Zirconia and Burlap and that idiot savant Ben Carson.

smile


And you're a racist to boot. How astonishing.
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#326590 - 06/13/20 05:46 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pdx rick Offline
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Yet another word that you don't know the definition of...racist. Racists like you who don't like ALL black Americans think of people as groups.

I cited three dumbass Conservatives who happen to be black. Nuance is not your forte in life, is it, homeschooler? rolleyes
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#326607 - 06/14/20 03:43 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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pdx says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Racists ...think of people as groups.


pdx also says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
I only loathe white Conservatives



If A = C and B = C, then A, my fellow poster, also = B wink
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#326608 - 06/14/20 03:47 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
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Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
pdx says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Racists ...think of people as groups.


pdx also says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
I only loathe white Conservatives



If A = C and B = C, then A, my fellow poster, also = B wink

Once again, your failure to understand what words mean comes to the forefront of your posts.

Conservatism is not a race, therefore, one cannot be racist against Conservatives. Race is not chosen, but political philosophies like conservatism are. White folks who chose conservatism are not a race as much as your North Carolina education wants it to be.

Your not-so-stellar thinking is on display again for the whole world to see. smile
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#326612 - 06/14/20 04:10 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
pdx says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Racists ...think of people as groups.


pdx also says:

Originally Posted By: pdx rick
I only loathe white Conservatives



If A = C and B = C, then A, my fellow poster, also = B wink

Once again, your failure to understand what words mean comes to the forefront of your posts.

Conservatism is not a race, therefore, one cannot be racist against Conservatives. Race is not chosen, but political philosophies like conservatism are. White folks who chose conservatism are not a race as much as your North Carolina education wants it to be.

Your not-so-stellar thinking is on display again for the whole world to see. smile

Bigotry is Bigotry. I'm sorry you live such a sad and hate-filled life.


Edited by CPWILL (06/14/20 04:10 PM)
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#326614 - 06/14/20 04:30 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Bigotry is Bigotry. I'm sorry you live such a sad and hate-filled life.

Once again your failure to understand what words mean comes to the forefront of your posts.

Bigotry is not the same thing as racism. - each word as a very different and specific meaning from the other. Don't you people get tired of being schooled by Liberals? Hmm

If I am a bigot against people who choose conservatism - a philosophy known to put a knee to the neck of minorities in every aspect of life, then so be it. Guilty as charged. Might as well say that I am antiFA as well. smile
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#326615 - 06/14/20 04:34 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
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Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
I'm sorry you live such a sad and hate-filled life.

I don't hate, I appreciate that I'm not a conservative like YOU. smile
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#326619 - 06/14/20 08:43 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
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Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10139
Loc: North San Diego County
For all the Trump tweets demonizing antifa, I love the fact that police and FBI are actually arresting alt-right extremists instead because they are the ones actually planning or carrying out mass murders and terrorist acts.

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#326621 - 06/14/20 10:46 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pondering_it_all]
pdx rick Offline
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Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43122
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: pondering_it_all
For all the Trump tweets demonizing antifa, I love the fact that police and FBI are actually arresting alt-right extremists instead because they are the ones actually planning or carrying out mass murders and terrorist acts.

Bow

Both Barr and Trump lied about this. Hmm
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#326624 - 06/15/20 02:49 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: pdx rick]
CPWILL Offline
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Registered: 12/26/19
Posts: 423
Originally Posted By: pdx rick
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
Bigotry is Bigotry. I'm sorry you live such a sad and hate-filled life.

Once again your failure to understand what words mean comes to the forefront of your posts.

Bigotry is not the same thing as racism. - each word as a very different and specific meaning from the other. Don't you people get tired of being schooled by Liberals? Hmm

If I am a bigot against people who choose conservatism - a philosophy known to put a knee to the neck of minorities in every aspect of life, then so be it. Guilty as charged. Might as well say that I am antiFA as well. smile


Oh, you're a racist as well. Bigotry tends to spill out that way.

And it's unfortunate. When Haas invited me here, he explained this was a place for people who played "billiards, not pool" and who, because they were all adults, didn't really need moderation, because they acted like adults.

To be fair, you are the only major poster actively proving him wrong, so, I guess you really do get that 10% everywhere.


Edited by CPWILL (06/15/20 02:50 PM)
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#326720 - 06/19/20 12:26 PM Re: The Far-Right's Civil War aka "boogaloo" [Re: CPWILL]
logtroll Offline
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Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 10284
Loc: One of the Mexicos
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
When Haas invited me here, he explained this was a place for people who played "billiards, not pool" and who, because they were all adults, didn't really need moderation, because they acted like adults.

Not necessarily 100% of the time.

A video of a Boogaloo Boys training camp (the Hawaiian shirt is the giveaway):


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