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#327157 - 07/07/20 06:27 PM Mysteries not solved
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I was going to put this in another topic but it got large and so I stuck it here. This is a rambling list of confusion.

Apparently, the two rallies (Tulsa and Phoenix) the Trump held doesn't seem to have caused anybody to get infected with Covid-19 I searched and searched and failed and failed. Seems to me that something must have happened?

Then, perhaps, each did cause infections but both locations are having such a pile of positives that its difficult to determine whether the rallies were responsible or not. Now add in the problems with the tests. The labs are behind and the tests themselves are not great so the answer to both is a resounding "we don't really know"!

Then there is the simple fact that Trump has, consistently, opposed any testing from the getgo. Now, after months of shortages and lack of capacity absolutely nothing seems to have changed. The tests are not all that accurate, chemicals are in low supply, labs are behind, etc. One can only wonder if this magic remains an indication of Trump's hands or its just sheer incompetence on the part of our entire health community. I even question why in the world our tests themselves haven't gotten better over the months. One would have thought................

Then there is Trump's apparent inability, or unwillingness, to share his incredible skill with our tests thereby proving that the tests themselves are responsible for the continuing increase in those infected by Covid-19. This obvious Trump truth then, tends to show that the same thing might be useful to allow cars to run forever if the owner of such cars simply disconnect their fuel indicator. The logic is flawless. Fewer tests fewer positives, no fuel gauges less fuel usage! Amazing! I can think of a whole lot of things this should work on. The only problem is that Trump is, obviously, hiding this fact from the American public which should rise up and demand the answer!

Then there is the mystery of why Trump, or anybody in his family, has not been infected. This remains a deep mystery to me! I have queried on this one before and am beginning to believe that he has access to a secret medicine that protects him, and his family, and is being kept secret from everybody else in the nation.

One last thing. Every night I watch TV and every night I am treated with graphs showing that most other countries have their Covid-19 under control and we don't. Apparently Trump is going to tell us to just "live with it" even though others have beat it and are on their way to normalcy. We are, obviously, not. Everytime I see this I keep on thinking; "This has got to piss off somebody!" and every night I am wrong. In another topic I have been beating up on our electorate. This just makes that attitude even more reasonable.

We are told, regularly, that Trump is winning when it comes to expertise to fix the economy. This one blows me away. There has been absolutely no reason for this. The guy was gifted with 450 million dollars to start with. He has bankoed 6 times, every business has pretty much failed except for the name selling con he does and even that is under considerable pressure. His past economic success was due to his taking over from Obama that gave him the good economy that he did have! We are being told that over 50% of our electorate, after being given any number of these negative facts about Trump continue to support his efforts. Given the man's economic past I would suggest that makes no sense at all but, in spite of that, he rules the subject. If nothing else this tends to make me think even less of our mythic knowing electorate.

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#327161 - 07/07/20 09:30 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
I would qualify that 50% of the electorate idea: Hillary actually won the popular vote by several million votes. So the dummies who made him President are people in a few states.

As for cases coming from the rallies, that takes a while because death by Covid-19 takes over a month. It could be that he and his family have some monoclonal antibody from that California company. We'll see what happens to Don Junior: His girlfriend has tested positive and they said they would drive back to DC together. Junior is in the perfect transmission bubble. If he is not positive shortly, I'd say the monoclonal antibody is in play.

In a lot of ways, it's the perfect Trump solution: Very very expensive, so just billionaires and their families get it.

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#327174 - 07/08/20 06:24 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Its all very strange to me. Apparently, when you are positive, bad things happen. There are reports, for instance, that youth that get it, and its not all that bad seems to come out with a damaged and scarred set of lungs and recurring pain, loss of energy, serious strokes, etc. There seems to be a long list of stuff one can end up with that are not immediately experienced. There is an english guy (forget his name) that that appears on TV, usually about things economic. Anyway, he got it, it wasn't real bad, but now, 6 months after having been found to be positive, he gets visits than can be painful (for a bit), loses energy and has to lay down, etc. and he said there are no warnings and its something he is going to have to, apparently, live with for the rest of his life. I think he is 50 something in age.

Anyway, if this is true one would think that somebody would be warning the errant youth causing much of our current problems, that if they do get it then its also likely that they are not going to be really well for the rest of their lives! This is serious s***! They don't seem to get it but they are going to learn and then they will whine about how nobody told them and had they known (I have read about several so far but there are going to be a LOT more!)

This even gets more interesting. First all the people being ejected from their rentals means that there is a serious bump in the number of our homeless. Eventually gov will try and build something for them. The last time we did that we got the 'projects' with no security, etc. Hopefully we learned our lesson but, given the current pressure on police department one has to wonder what happens next. I have talked to a number of homeless here, especially individuals sleeping alone. I asked why they don't go to where the beds are and each one says the same thing. In groups of homeless there always seems to be predators who will steal everything you own, savage you, etc. If you talk to police they will tell you the same thing yet when we talk about homeless its about the group and their problems seem to be theirs alone an kindofa secret.

Then there is the problem (I may be exaggerating but maybe not) with those who are positive, weathered the initial onslaught but now have scarred lungs, stroke problems, heart problems, etc. Keeping in mind a majority of people are going to experience their positivity for a very long and miserable time this is going to put huge pressure on our health system. The only way we are going to be able to deal with that is to provide healthcare for EVERYBODY! In other words, healthcare is going to have to be socialized or we are going to have, literally, millions of sick people, many homeless, filling our streets and corners and anyplace with a roof. In other words we are, right now, creating a huge problem for the nation.

Between the homeless and the positives life in America is going to get a LOT different regardless of anything else.

So, there will be a time when we have some kind of cure for Covid-19 (not exactly sure what that is going to look like in the end). When that happens there is going to be a huge vat of problems that are going to have to be addressed and nobody, as far as I can tell, are giving that one a whole lot of thought (suspect them in ivory towers are but haven't gone public yet).

Given that I am 85 I am just doing my best to hide out as I REALLY am not interested in trying it out (unlike the brain dead kids of Trumpland who think its a lark). So far I am lucky but now we are starting to get tourists from Seattle so ......

Apologies - it tend to go on, and on, and on (kinda embarrassing <G>)

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#327180 - 07/08/20 08:58 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Certainly, at 85 you want to avoid it at all costs. In much younger folks the aftermath is usually pretty benign, but not for all of them. That poor 41 year old Broadway star who just died took months, and had one complication after another. Death was a blessing, but it would have been more of a blessing a couple of months ago.

A lot of the long lasting effects look like they could be caused by cytokine storm clotting. The lining of the blood vessels have ACE II receptor sites, so the virus can get in and destroy those cells. That releases some stuff that makes microscopic clots throughout your blood stream. Those clots can block capillaries, killing various organs for lack of oxygen. They can join up into bigger clots and give you a heart attack or stroke.

We have some pretty good drugs to counteract cytokine storm. The trouble is figuring out who needs them. Some people have no symptoms but go into the storm and get sick or die. And once you have had some of certain organ's tissues die, they never regenerate. Liver is great at making a comeback if you survive long enough. Kidneys, brain, heart, and pancreas not so much.

It may be that we should give everybody recuperating at home a prescription for a steroid and an anticoagulant to start taking as soon as they recover from the virus. Those really should have medical supervision, but with hospitals filled maybe we need to relax those requirements for the people who can't be seen.

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#327195 - 07/09/20 06:29 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I watched one doctor, in Texas, say that they started x-raying people college age or greater and ALL those who were positive had lung scarring. This was true for those who thought they had a walk in the park and it was nothing as well as others. Lung scarring does not heal its just there and when they strain themselves or get older they WILL have problems!

I also suspect that those who play sports don't know it yet but they will learn that their sports, for the most part are all over.

This Covid-19 is a sneaky bugger!


Edited by jgw (07/09/20 06:30 PM)

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#327214 - 07/10/20 06:14 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I watched another doctor, a pathologist this time. She was in complete agreement with you as to the clots thing. She was finding them EVERYPLACE, in multiple subjects! Just thought you would want to know that.

Here is one you might be interested in:
https://abc7.com/dr-troy-pennington-arro...avirus/6309969/

(treatments are getting better?)


Edited by jgw (07/10/20 06:20 PM)

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#327218 - 07/10/20 07:30 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
I'm not just making this stuff up. I'm not a pathologist like my wife, or an MD. When I post things here, I'm just reporting what actual MDs treating Covid-19 patients, pathologists, epidemiologists, and research scientists have said. Some of that is hypothesis, but it always has multiple accepted research references to back it up. When something is MY hypothesis, I am careful to say something like "I suspect".

So really, she is not in agreement with me, so much as I agree with what she has to report. She's the one doing the autopsies. I'm just a fanboy.

And yes, treatments have got a LOT better. Especially since doctors figured out to ignore WHO and start using steroids for cytokine storm and anticoagulents for the clotting. But you are in grave danger if your health care provider refuses to use these, and many do. Doing the MATH+ protocol at home is probably safer than going into a hospital that ignores the latest info, up until you need oxygen.

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#327230 - 07/11/20 05:04 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Hopefully I won't have to find out. Our local positives is now up to 95 for the county which has a population of around 77,000 Nobody is currently hospitalized and we have had no deaths due to Covid-19. They have traced every positive and taken care of it.

https://www.google.com/search?client=ubu...-8&oe=utf-8

Actually we are doing pretty good! Just hope we can keep it up. Much of our increases have been due to travel to Seattle, getting infected and then returning or family gatherings for the 4th of July. Its also tourist season and they are coming. Most of the big resorts are now full. Still, we are not doing badly and can only hope that continues.

If I have to go to the grocery store I try to go in the early morning. Safeway is a block away and there is very few there around 8 or 9 in the morning. Our governor has also put a new regulation which says that ALL businesses can only allow people in who are wearing a mask which is also helping.


Edited by jgw (07/11/20 05:06 PM)

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#327231 - 07/11/20 06:54 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17049
Loc: Florida
I wish Florida would put a mask rule in place, but if nothing else, at least we can serve as a bad example.

I went shopping without a mask yesterday. The store was busy and I couldn't get a handicapped parking space. I left it in the car and by the time I remembered it walking back was a worse option than doing without. I was ashamed of myself but I certainly wasn't alone in my maskless state, most wore masks but fully a quarter of the shoppers did not.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#327239 - 07/11/20 08:41 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
It would be great if all the stores had disposable masks given out for free right at the entrance. That way they don't have to confront anybody and turn them away. All they have to do is give them a free mask as they apologize for the new state rule. Much less confrontational. Maybe they need a gun-check, too.

Stores in other countries have added hand sanitizer people at the entrance. A lot of stores here offer disinfecting wipes for cart rails, though a much bigger problem is babies with leaky diapers sitting in the cart seat. It would be nice if stores had people doing all those: Giving out and enforcing masks, cleaning carts, and squirting everybody with hand sanitizer.

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#327249 - 07/11/20 11:45 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17049
Loc: Florida
My store has people wiping down the carts for you if they'd have offered me a mask I'd have surely taken it.

Just heard that a bus driver in France was killed for asking someone to wear a mask.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#327254 - 07/12/20 04:57 AM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: Greger]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
a bus driver in France was killed for asking someone to wear a mask


That's pretty counterproductive: The bus doesn't go anywhere if you shoot the driver.

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#327262 - 07/12/20 05:04 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17049
Loc: Florida
That's the problem with Republican policy in general.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#327269 - 07/12/20 06:08 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Every store in town, I think, offer free masks if a customer doesn't have one. Everybody I have spoken to is says its going pretty good and nobody is going nuts over being forced to wear a mask. My suspicion is that they have made a decision about some political baloney and getting sick or wearing a mask and staying healthy.

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#327270 - 07/12/20 06:50 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
Every store in town, I think, offer free masks


Excellent! Good start. Anybody who wants them can bring their own wipes and hand sanitizer, but it's difficult to get other shoppers to wear masks and that's how we benefit from them.

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#327292 - 07/13/20 06:54 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Most stores also have hand sanitizer available at the front door (I usually use it at Safeway. I went there this morning but forgot <sigh>). I didn't however, forget my chocolate chip cookies!


Edited by jgw (07/13/20 06:55 PM)

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#327304 - 07/14/20 12:19 AM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Quote:
chocolate chip cookies


I wish! I love chocolate, including those Trader Joe's one pound bars of very dark. I used to eat those in a few days. But I have not been able to handle any chocolate for a couple of decades. I get terrible heartburn from just one bite.

So it's oatmeal or iced animal cookies for me, with Costco Chai instead of hot cocoa. I can process white chocolate, so sometimes I get those Pepperidge Farms white chocolate chip cookies. My local health food store has coconut white chocolate-coated almonds (for $7 a pound) that taste just like an Almond Joy candy bar! So I am not too deprived.

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#327305 - 07/14/20 01:35 AM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43115
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: jgw
Apparently, the two rallies (Tulsa and Phoenix) the Trump held doesn't seem to have caused anybody to get infected with Covid-19 I searched and searched and failed and failed. Seems to me that something must have happened?

Au contraire:

Tulsa health official says Trump rally "likely contributed" to spike in coronavirus cases

Hmm
_________________________
Contrarian, extraordinaire



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#327307 - 07/14/20 01:41 AM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17049
Loc: Florida
What about carob chip cookies? maybe not a perfect solution but damned close.
_________________________
Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#327317 - 07/14/20 04:41 AM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Carob is okay, but not that much like chocolate. White chocolate is much closer. I could buy white chocolate chips and make my own. I actually love my own oatmeal raisin cookies, and have yet to find any commercial oatmeal raisin that are as good. I made some almond cookies the other day for my wheat-intolerant wife. Pretty amazing: Just almond flour, butter, sugar, and water. Came out terrific.

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#327338 - 07/14/20 07:46 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pdx rick]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
Yep. I spoke waaay too fast! (and I was flat out wrong). It is, however, interesting. The internet, right now, is full of idiots who thought that Covid-19 wasn't real. At least one of them, after admitting the error, is now dead from it. I think that this stuff is going to make a difference and, perhaps, idiots are starting to understand its actually VERY real!

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#327341 - 07/14/20 08:12 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: pondering_it_all]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3453
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I LOVE those 1 pound bars! they cost about 5 bucks. they sell them on ebay for around 15.00 (I wait to goto trader joe to buy them). My problem is that I have few problems when filling my gut. Its getting very close to the time I stop eating and fast for a couple of weeks at the very least. During that time I eat boiled eggs, cheese and almonds and walnuts. its kinda hard for the first week then its clear sailing.

I remember telling my heart doctor about the above plan to lose weight when needed. He started laughing and told me that he did exactly the same thing and asked if I ate much of those things and I told him that after the first week I sometimes was on a diet of water. He asked if I took vitamins and I told him I did. Then he told me he did exactly the same thing and laughed again. He said he wouldn't tell anybody to do it as there are those that disagree but it has worked for him and its worked for me for about 40 years. My only real problem is that my wife really hates it when I do it because it screws up her own eating (its all my fault <G>)

Oh, my heart. Seems I had a really bad heart attack. I never knew I had one. I was going through a physical and somebody spotted something and then did a 3d picture, with an ultrasound, of my heart which was pretty interesting. It was not only colorful but I got to see the scar on my heart. I asked them if they had anybody else that had a serious heart attack they were unaware of and I was told that it wasn't unusual. Always thought that was a bit strange. As far as I know I have no heart problems right now.

Didn't mean to inflict all that on you - sometimes just to chatty for my own good.....

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#327348 - 07/14/20 11:15 PM Re: Mysteries not solved [Re: jgw]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10128
Loc: North San Diego County
Heart attacks can be very weird. You can have one in your sleep that doesn't hurt enough to wake you, because your heart is not working very hard. You just have less cardiac output capability from then on. Silent heart attacks are quite common for women.

My wife and I have diverged so much, what with her wheat sensitivity, that we usually don't cook or even eat together. When I cook something, I try to make it without wheat if possible, just so she can eat it. Like moco loco (Hawaiian hamburger patty over rice with beef gravy): I use rice flour to make the gravy.

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