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#327454 - 07/19/20 06:43 AM We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43342
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Quote:
Back in the years before Reagan, a real estate lobbying group called the Foundation for Economic Education (FEE) came up with the idea of creating a political party to justify deregulating the real estate and finance industries so they could make more money. The party would give them ideological and political cover, and they developed an elaborate theology around it.

It was called the Libertarian Party, and their principal argument was that if everybody acted separately and independently, in all cases with maximum selfishness, that that would benefit society. There would be no government needed beyond an army and a police force, and a court system to defend the rights of property owners.

In 1980, billionaire David Koch ran for vice president on the newly formed Libertarian Party ticket. His platform was to privatize the Post Office, shut down all public schools, privatize Medicare and Medicaid, end food stamps and all other forms of “welfare,” deregulate all corporate oversight, and sell off much of the federal government’s land and other assets to billionaires and big corporations.

Since then, Libertarian billionaires and right-wing media have been working hard to get Americans to agree with Ronald Reagan’s statement from his first inaugural address that, “[G]overnment is not the solution to our problem; government is the problem.”

- Thom Hartmann

It's good that decent Boomers are still around to educate us about the history of selfishness and greed. I now understand how two prized Rightwing virtues, selfishness and greed, are baked into Rightwing politics. smile
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#327461 - 07/19/20 03:33 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
Greger Offline


Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 11/24/06
Posts: 17309
Loc: Florida
Quite right! And the Libertarian/Republican mantra is that socialists are out to destroy our country.

Quote:
There would be no government needed beyond an army and a police force, and a court system to defend the rights of property owners.

And right now on the streets of Portland an army and a police force are beating, gassing, and kidnapping dissenters. They are unhindered in their killing of anyone who stands in their way or even gets in their way.
Welcome to America where the pandemic only serves as another way to increase the wealth of those few who are genuinely free to do as they please with impunity.
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Good coffee, good weed, and time on my hands...

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#327469 - 07/19/20 05:32 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: Greger]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43342
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: Greger
Quite right! And the Libertarian/Republican mantra is that socialists are out to destroy our country.

Quote:
There would be no government needed beyond an army and a police force, and a court system to defend the rights of property owners.

And right now on the streets of Portland an army and a police force are beating, gassing, and kidnapping dissenters. They are unhindered in their killing of anyone who stands in their way or even gets in their way.
Welcome to America where the pandemic only serves as another way to increase the wealth of those few who are genuinely free to do as they please with impunity.

Bow
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#327473 - 07/19/20 07:43 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
jgw Online   content
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3627
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
At the risk of offending I would remind that ALL branches of far right conservatism have some beliefs that are hard to understand. One of those beliefs is that government is evil because they actually take away a person's right to make their own choices. So, if an elderly person, who has always been poor, and now has no food their condition in life is due to their very own decisions when younger and should starve on the streets so that everybody else can see what happens if you don't make the right decisions. I can give you any number of real life examples of that. One more - they believe that about Social Security and want that gone. People have an absolute right to not save anything for the future but get to pay for that too.

These people are not out to destroy the country. They actually believe that doing this stuff would help the country and stop a lot of the current 'nonsense' which IS destroying the country.

I realize this is hard for some to understand but, I think, its also important that everybody understands the roots of the far right and how they think.

I, for instance, believe, first, that people need regulation. Its kinda like belief in original sin. People, as a group, have proven that if they are not regulated they tend to jump off in the deep end and everybody pays for it. I also believe that there are certain things in a society that should be paid for by everybody in that society for the common good. Some of these things are Libraries, public schools, police departments, fire departments, healthcare, etc. I am not a socialist, and these, as far as I am concerned are not socialist thing but things that everybody uses, needs, and should support.

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#327485 - 07/20/20 12:52 AM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: jgw]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43342
Loc: Puget Sound, WA
Originally Posted By: jgw
... its also important that everybody understands the roots of the far right and how they think..

To be frank, I don't give a shyt how a Righwinger thinks. Being Rightwing is a choice in life.

These people are not born to be greedy, selfish, aholes who follow a "me, me, me..." philosophy in life. Rightwingerism is not like being born with brown skin, or gay or transgender. Rightwingerism is a choice. Rightwingers choose to be on the wrong side of history.

Rightwingers voted for Trump in the hope that he’d ruin other people’s lives, not their own. Rightwingers wanted a reality TV show President and now America is on SURVIVOR.

Trump was elected by racist Rightwingers to restore the cultural narrative of the primacy of whiteness. Rightwingers loathed that establishment forces allowed or encouraged the ascension of multicultural power and expense of white culture and white advantage and saw Donald Trump as the man to right these wrongs. Rightwingers possess the cynical belief that immigrants are out to steal their small house and their lousy job.

Rightwingers have always confused not being in charge or the majority with being oppressed. Rightwingers have a talent for side-stepping the truth, by offering half-truths. Rightwingers lack candor and the veracity for truthfulness.

Rightwingers always find ways to excuse their barbaric behavior. Rightwinges exhibit the “dark triad” of human behavior: Machiavellianism, psychopathy and narcissism. Rightwingers have no core values that can't be sacrificed in the name of political expedience or profit.

Rightwingers foment racial and ethnic conflict. Rightwingers defend racist statues of Confederates and proudly display the Confederate flag - a symbol of slavery - America's dark past.

Rightwingers refuse to wear a mask to curtail the spread of a new virus to mankind. I would even suggest there is a racial aspect to this decision by Righwingers. Ever since studies have shown that COVID-19 is killing three times as many African Americans as whites, Trump, the Republicans and Trump cultists have decided to spread COVID-19 as widely as they can manage to. Rightwingers very idea of having the exact same health care plan as people they see as beneath them, especially lower-income people of color, causes an angry reaction.

Trump’s defeat in November 2020 will be humiliating for Rightwingers and it should! mad I simply cannot find common ground with these people. Hmm

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#327486 - 07/20/20 06:12 AM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
Irked Offline
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Registered: 12/14/05
Posts: 3559
Loc: Somewhere out in left field
The problem is that your typical right winger does not think, so there is nothing to learn on that score. They swallow whole and regurgitate the nice package of nonsense stories and myths they get from their leaders, stories where they are the chosen people, the best of the best.

It doesn’t matter if the stories make no sense or if they change on a daily basis, just as long as the leaders reaffirm that they, and only they, are worthy of salvation and that the evil-doers will be vanquished and suffer eternally.
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How eager they are to be slaves - Tiberius Caesar

Coulda tripped out easy, but I've changed my ways - Donovan

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#327490 - 07/20/20 01:02 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
pdx rick Offline
Member
CHB-OG

Registered: 05/09/05
Posts: 43342
Loc: Puget Sound, WA

I've always said that Righwingers love their information spoon-fed to them like it was pablum - which is why they watch Fox News.

STUDY: Watching Only Fox News Makes You Less Informed Than Watching No News At All
Link
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#327500 - 07/20/20 07:16 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10381
Loc: North San Diego County
The Conservative view of life is that of a zero-sum game. Way too much competitive sports has influenced their lives. Their way is to poke holes in every other's boat so they are the only group left above water.

But that's not the Liberal way: We want everybody to do well. All boats rise on the tide, so to speak. We want a fair economic system and ultimately to show Conservatives that life in such a system is better for everybody, including them.

They think Liberals are stupid because we refuse to see that life is a competition, and you are either a Winner or a Loser. That's why they make fun of "participation trophies". We think they are ignorant because they never consider the power of cooperation and inclusion. But there is hope: Ignorance can be cured. This is why most conservatives make use of Social Security, Medicare, unemployment insurance, and even Obamacare-compliant health insurance if not ACA itself. All Liberal ideas that Conservatives have come to embrace: Their ignorance was cured, by the great power of cooperation.

Even Ayn Rand collected Social Security and Medicare benefits.

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#327502 - 07/20/20 07:34 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
jgw Online   content
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 3627
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
What I have never understood is their capacity to fight over obvious fact. For instance, take Republican governors. Many are currently fighting Covid-19 the Trump way. This is, obviously, crazy. All they have to do is take a look at how Europe is doing to see the error of their ways but, I guess, that's too much to expect. Several, over the years, have taken conservative economics all the way and virtually bankrupted their own state even in the face of watching another Republican governor do, exactly, the same thing. its kinda like one definition of insanity, ie. "If you keep doing exactly the same thing to get a different result". I have knows some of these people and I sometimes ask the question even though I expect the same old answer which is, normally, "<sigh>, you will just never understand". They are absolutely right!

I do not, however, think that they are an enemy or that they are determined to hurt anybody. They are actually believers in their fellow humans. For instance, they actually believe that people will do exactly the right thing if they have the opportunity! In other words, they actually believe in people! (I rarely do and its saved me any number of times)

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#327506 - 07/20/20 08:20 PM Re: We have now reached peak Libertarianism - and it is literally killing us [Re: pdx rick]
pondering_it_all Offline
veteran

Registered: 02/27/06
Posts: 10381
Loc: North San Diego County
It's funny that Conservatives say they believe people will make the right choices and Liberals say they won't. The Communists believed people would make the right choices, too, and look where that got them! We have perfect proof that people will not make the right choices, in the fact that 401Ks and IRAs are severely underfunded. People had the opportunity to make those right choices, and they didn't.

What Conservatives actually want is for people to have the opportunity to make bad choices, so the Conservatives will be the "winners" and those poor idiots the "losers". But I see no facts that show those Conservatives do make the right choices! Like retirees voting for people who want to cut Social Security. Or poor folks who vote for tax cutters so when they win the Lotto their taxes will be lower.

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