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#304061 - 11/22/17 09:27 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: joebialek123]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16204
At the time the Second Amendment was adopted, cartridges (other than paper), much less repeating rifles, had not yet been invented. Hell, the rifle was a rarity. (Barrel rifling was invented in Augsburg, Germany in 1498.[5] In 1520 August Kotter, an armourer of Nuremberg, Germany improved upon this work. Though true rifling dates from the mid-16th century, it did not become commonplace until the nineteenth century. - Wikipedia) "Originalists" should remember that.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#304075 - 11/23/17 01:02 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: joebialek123]
rporter314 Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 6485
Loc: Highlands, Tx
Originalism, I suspect emanates from conservative intellectual limitations. Conservatives fundamentally do not or can not reflect on anything other than the precise spoken or written word. It is this limitation which constrains their arguments and refutations to a simple, I did not say that or that is not written in the Constitution. Had mathematicians been so constrained we would not have any technology, for it is in logical derivation that progress is made. One does not have to explicitly say or write a thing for one to mean something which can be derived from other things one has said or written.

J Stephans minority opinion in DC v Heller is closer to originalist thinking than the opinion offered by J Scalia which leaned on the modern NRA claims of originalism rather than the Constitution or then current law.

In my humble opinion .... and may I now give thanks to the Founders for their wisdom in writing such an inspiring document which allows me to voice my opinion without fear of government retribution.

Happy holiday however you guys may spend it
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ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty

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#304105 - 11/25/17 08:44 AM Re: Gun Control [Re: rporter314]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16204
Man Shoots Woman After Mistaking Her for a Deer. I'm so pissed about this, and incredibly sad.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#304106 - 11/25/17 02:57 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: NW Ponderer]
logtroll Offline
veteran

Registered: 04/26/10
Posts: 8867
Loc: New Mexico (not old Mexico)
200 yard shot after sunset with a pistol... will he walk free? How much less egregious would it be if it had been a deer he was shooting at?

The problem with guns in America is predominantly a lack of a responsible attitude on the part of many gun owners. There is more social responsibility associated with driving a car or buying drugs.
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"You can't fix a problem until you understand what the problem is." Logtroll

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#304109 - 11/25/17 05:41 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: joebialek123]
rporter314 Offline
old hand

Registered: 03/18/03
Posts: 6485
Loc: Highlands, Tx
The response from NRA will be even irresponsible persons have a right etc etc

education education education
_________________________
ignorance is the enemy
without equality there is no liberty

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#304110 - 11/25/17 06:22 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: joebialek123]
NW Ponderer Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel

Registered: 09/09/11
Posts: 16204
The truth is, this person was no hunter. Period. A hunter knows his target and only shoots with a clean shot, a clear background, and an appropriate weapon. None of those obtained in this situation. Manslaughter, at least. Murder on the basis of "reckless indifference" (Depraved-heart). Several lives ruined.
_________________________
A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich

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#304114 - 11/25/17 10:50 PM Re: Gun Control [Re: joebialek123]
jgw Offline
enthusiast

Registered: 05/22/06
Posts: 2099
Loc: Port Angeles, WA
I am getting some humor out of the hunter thing. This is a true story. Several years ago 4 guys went into the Olympic National Park and actually herded an entire herd of elk into the Elwah valley outside of the park. After they had done they left the herd, until the next day, when they planned to kill themselves some elk (they all had tags for their kill). The next day they showed up and 'somebody' blew the whistle and its estimated that there were at least 100 hunters surrounding the herd. They all let fly. There were fistfights (I shot this one and its mine), bullets were flying, guys were claiming, yelling, fighting, etc. When it was all over the entire herd had been slaughtered (ALL, male, female, calves, ALL!). The miraculous thing was that nobody get killed (a couple get wounds from bullets, fists, gun butts, etc.

I am not a hunter (given this one I think not being a hunter is a LOT safer!) I have been around hunters my entire life. Several of my friends were at this little extravaganza and several of those decided that they wouldn't be hunters anymore. Anyway, given the modern hunter who does this kind of stuff, take sound shots, and, as far as I am concerned, waaay to stupid to survive in the long run, I would suggest that thoughts of only shooting clean shots, clear background, etc. is rapidly becoming a bit like the belief in hunters as reasonable, smart folks. Those that survive are fortunate and, I am told, its getting worse every year.

Anyway, my amusement is because anybody who thinks that 'real' hunters and just plain idiots is a difference that remains, at least in my own mind, questionable.

OH, one last thought. I have always thought that at least one national park should be set aside for taking care of them that have been convicted of murder and sentenced to death. All them so convicted would have a choice - state execution or participating in the following it would work like this. The park would be fenced in rigorously, and hunting permits issued for them that wanted to 'hunt' the convicted miscreants. The convicted would be turned loose with what they are wearing and a 6 inch knife - nothing else. Gov would provide video of all hunts to be sold to the highest bidder. Given all the promises of more jobs this one should provide lots of jobs of one sort or another and it wouldn't cost much. The licenses would be sold to the highest bidder. Please note - I have not mentioned the possibilities, insofar, as undertaking, taxidermy, etc is concerned. My thought is that this one should bring in the big bucks for general national park upkeep. My feeling is that something like this would really work in a Trump universe.

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