Today's Birthdays
There are no members with birthdays on this day.
Current Topics
What's for dinner?
by Ken Condon - 12/05/21 03:18 AM
Winning
by perotista - 12/05/21 01:32 AM
lying on the internet
by jgw - 12/04/21 11:30 PM
RoundTable For Fall 2021
by pdx rick - 12/04/21 11:08 PM
... doubt is our product...
by TatumAH - 12/04/21 08:13 PM
Beautiful, beautiful language...
by logtroll - 12/04/21 05:19 PM
A Musical Quiz
by Ken Condon - 12/04/21 03:46 AM
Denialism
by Greger - 12/03/21 03:37 PM
Coronavirus: The Plague of The 21st Century?
by pondering_it_all - 12/01/21 08:51 PM
I’ll Buy That
by Greger - 12/01/21 07:22 PM
Boundaries for Facebook
by jgw - 11/30/21 06:26 PM
Pacific Northwest Weather
by pdx rick - 11/28/21 08:59 PM
A Fungus Amungus
by logtroll - 11/28/21 01:25 PM
Republicans promise brutal revenge in 2022
by pdx rick - 11/27/21 08:45 PM
masks and vaccinations
by logtroll - 11/27/21 01:36 PM
Vigilantism - why isn’t it illegal?
by logtroll - 11/25/21 11:46 PM
"Mom, I think it's a boy."
by TatumAH - 11/25/21 04:37 AM
Popular Topics(Views)
9,689,222 my own book page
4,786,216 We shall overcome
3,876,156 Campaign 2016
3,532,667 Trump's Trumpet
2,796,933 3 word story game
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Rate Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 483
C
newbie
Offline
newbie
C
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 483
I'd like to welcome you all to the Conservative Movement laugh We've been talking about how extremely powerful public sector unions protect bad members from consequences and are bad for the public for years laugh

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 17,642
Likes: 25
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 17,642
Likes: 25
Originally Posted By: Spag-hetti
I'm generally a pro-union kind of gal, but it sure seems like there's something rotten going on with the union and the whole system. Chauvin had been investigated 17 times and disciplined only once. That suggests weak enforcement of rules and a strong union that makes enforcement more difficult. Maybe instead of disbanding the force, they should require every police department employee to reapply for his/her job. Surely officers with records like Chauvin's wouldn't be attractive candidates. Plus they might be able to skate by the union with the old, "We didn't fire them; we just didn't rehire them."
Other jurisdictions have done this. It could work.

I am a strong union person, and pro law enforcement - have been my whole life. But, as with any organization, some are just bad. The Buffalo PBA is a great example, and Minnesota, a strong union State, has another. Both the MPD and State Police have some serious problems, which became overwhelmingly evident during the protests. They displayed some of the most inexcusable behavior I've ever seen in law enforcement (I was a law enforcement advisor for 13 years) - firing indiscriminately at peaceful protesters, slashing car tires, targeting journalists, and even targeting people sitting peacefully on their own porches.
Quote:
The Minneapolis Police Department previously agreed to changes in a federal mediation agreement with the U.S. Department of Justice in 2003. The agreement led to changes in police policy on use of force and improvements in mental health training. But critics say the department didnt follow through on other commitments, including discipline for officers who were the subject of multiple complaints, according to the Minneapolis Star Tribune.

Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey said in a statement that reforms have been thwarted by police union protections and laws that limit accountability.
Minnesota launches civil rights probe of state police department in hopes of bringing change (ABA Journal). With immunity comes impunity.

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 17,642
Likes: 25
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel
Offline
Moderator
Carpal Tunnel
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 17,642
Likes: 25
Originally Posted By: CPWILL
I'd like to welcome you all to the Conservative Movement laugh We've been talking about how extremely powerful public sector unions protect bad members from consequences and are bad for the public for years laugh
And, you've been wrong for years, too. It is not a "conservative" thing, and the "conservative" approach has been wrong from the outset. I expect you still oppose social security and welfare, too (a supposition, not an accusation). Most of us "liberals" have always been for good government. Not so much with "conservatives", some of whom just hate government.

Unions, and particularly public sector unions, have been very good for government and corporate responsibility. Why do you think there is even a "civil service"? Without accountability any organization becomes corrupt. That is true of unions, too. The problem with "conservative" thinking is twofold: first, everything is reduced to either-or, which is inconsistent with how the world works; and, second, "conservatives" tend to ignore the babies whenever they complain about the bathwater - whether it's civil rights, humanity, or even common sense.

I'm open to a detailed discussion of how to specify the issue, but if I want bumper-sticker pablum, I know where to find it.

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,381
Likes: 12
J
jgw Offline
old hand
Offline
old hand
J
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,381
Likes: 12
As far as I can tell Minneapolis is going to be in for over one million dollars in law suits this year alone. Camden, NJ fired their entire police department and then re-constituted it. I suspect they also got rid of the police union. They also fixed their police department which is now a community police department.

I continue to wonder how these cities can pay law suits costing millions, every year, because of bad police departments. Just makes no sense to me.

Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,672
member
Offline
member
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,672
Absolutely true, Greger. A worker shouldn't have to pay for a fair deal, but in America everything has a price tag, it seems.


Just a Missouri school teacher ... stubborn as a mule and addicted to logic.
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 44,695
Likes: 46
Member
CHB-OG
OP Offline
Member
CHB-OG
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 44,695
Likes: 46
Originally Posted By: Spag-hetti
Absolutely true, Greger. A worker shouldn't have to pay for a fair deal, but in America everything has a price tag, it seems.

Yup...it's called capitalism. Capitalism sure didn't help us for that six-week period where America was shut-down, did it?

What did get us through? Those Trump socialism checks and $600.00 week in unemployment wages... smile


Contrarian, extraordinaire


Page 2 of 2 1 2

Link Copied to Clipboard
Who's Online Now
0 members (), 34 guests, and 2 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
SuZQ2, KevFilthyANML, Risky, Gladys G. Jackson, Beach Baby
6,297 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums61
Topics17,256
Posts313,071
Members6,297
Most Online294
Dec 6th, 2017
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.4.26 Page Time: 0.010s Queries: 28 (0.003s) Memory: 3.0077 MB (Peak: 3.2531 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2021-12-05 05:10:40 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS