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Probably the main sameness comes from the ubiquitous human trait of narrowmindedness and prejudice (I always think of "prejudice" as "prejudgment").

Prejudgment leads to "broadbrushery", which is a far easier mindset to manage than juggling an infinite array of distinctions and contradictions, thus making life easier.

It's no secret that a life of ease is the Holy Grail of existence.

That might be a big reason that there is no difference.

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War budgets

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Originally Posted By: chunkstyle
War budgets

Are war budgets indicative of one party or the other? I suppose they might be if all three branches were under one party control.

In my own direct experience, Dems are far less enthused about funding wars than Reeps are.


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Here’s one - we can always count on a peaceful transition of power through our tried and true election process, with both parties respecting the will of the people.

(Nobody said that we could give positive examples...)


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In my experience, war budgets get passed with bipartisan support. We've been at war every year for decades. If there is a difference it's one without a distinction.

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Originally Posted By: logtroll
Here’s one - we can always count on a peaceful transition of power through our tried and true election process, with both parties respecting the will of the people.

(Nobody said that we could give positive examples...)


Uhh... no. Dems have been more and more open about rigging primaries. Blue check types are as guilty as MAGA types with their normalizing their parties behavior. Republicans have been just as brazen with stealing the general going back to Florida. Both monopolies have been committed to voter suppression. If there is violence, it would seem to be the next logical progression of both parties commitment to election fraud.

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Both parties are committed to austerity while copper stripping public goods and services. PayGo, Bowles-Simpson, etc...

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Cognitive dissonance has my head in a fuddle. The Dems I know aren't anything like what you keep saying. Agreed that policies don't tend to match the higher "promote the general Welfare" standards, but I suspect there are compounding factors in the stew that are always getting in the way of the advancement of our nobler desires.

One big problem that I have identified is the nettlesome habit of around half of Americans to elect assholes who fight tooth and nail against promotion of the general Welfare, as you point out. This has the effect of the introduction of compromise, which often appears to satisfy what the lawyers tell me; "A good outcome in any dispute is when neither side is happy". Well, that just stinks, and is a perverse attitude towards an ugly reality, but knowing that doesn't change the reality.

I'm going to poke you in the eye just a little bit and say that the position of saying "they are all the same kind of evil bastards" is a lame cop-out that covers no distance in improving the situation, it just makes people who should be friends snarl and snap at each other.

What is the solution? I personally don't think there is one that can be logically and rationally implemented. We humans seem to be seriously flawed, in varying forms and degrees - big problem. We are probably driving towards a major self-extinction event, blindly guided by selfishness and stupidity.

My only dreamer's hope is that more people personally aspiring to better things, and working (however futilely) to make those dream into a molecule of reality, will one day catalyze widespread sanity. (I keep my belief that such a thing is impossible in a little box and do my best to refuse to look at it.)


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On of the most helpful bits of advice was when someone told me to 'decolonize my mind'. An interesting concept, but when you think of how papogandized and mentally dominated the american public has been, arguably longer than most with media saturation, it calls into question the idea of 'free will'.

One mans arsehole is another mans champion but what have the arguments been limited to in the political economy? Most of the last 30-40 years have been centered on ID politics and tribal virtue signaling. Any challenge to existing economic or hedgemonic foreign policy is verboten in either party. Untill Trump and Sanders that is. Both parties have been committed to the same foreign policy and economic arrangements.

Hence the theft of two political primaries on the Dem side and jettison support of Trump on the other. Pearl clutching by Blue MAGA aside.

Going right has been nonstop and incessant in american politics over the last 50 years. I believe I've heard it called the 'ratcheting' effect. Both political factions have battled over cultural issues while economic or geopolitical policy has been broadly agreed too. While we can applaud gay marriage or gender neutral bathrooms, you can still starve in America as the economy has transitioned from a productive to rentier economy. That transition has been the direct result of bipartison policy going back to Carter. Dems have put up token resistance but their fundraising sources and austerity policies would say otherwise to their being the party to working Americans.

I've always brought reciepts. Can you say the same? I don't think bringing evidence to an argument should be characterized as 'copping out'. The 'New Democrat' political realignment did happen. Just as it did in the U.K. analog of 'New Labor' under the Blair government or Schroeder's SPD in Germany.

Interestingly, there seems to be some self reflection on the liberal perimeter. Not the majority, but some have had some mea culpa's recently. Paul Krugman comes to mind with his recent 'Maybe our position on de-industrialization thru trade wasn't a net benefit after all'. A prime example of how you can sound smart but lack any common sense. MMT is trying to eradicate much of that 'language of minimum's' that's been employed by both political factions. A language I've first discovered on reading about British colonial governance that was used to extract resources while offering a rational of minimum return investment in the form of education, medicine, infrastructure, etc.. That language is being used against our citizens today. Our governments factions learned it from mother.

Pointing out the broad alignments in both parties is not causing the division, IMO. Most politics are centered around tribal or vindictiveness. Both factions want to punish the other while both believe they're the better side. Phooey!

One has to ask how one political party held congress for 40 years under the new deal consensus while same party, after it's neoliberal alignment, has traded house majorities between themselves and their culturally distinct but economically aligned alternative.

Finally, both parties are committed to the illegality of any alternative. TINA. This is reflected in foreign policy as well with the destruction of foreign governments and societies, non stop, over the decades. I would be surprised if Biden doesn't hit Venezuela. Liberals and neocons are thirsty to do it.

A good article covering a foriegn policy paper:

"But Americans don’t have to look abroad for evidence that they are ill-served by their own system. The pervasive government incompetence on display during the ongoing coronavirus pandemic tells them all they need to know.

These days, American consumers buy plenty of products that carry “Made in China” labels. Yet the most pressing problems afflicting our nation—inequality, racism, disunity, the waning legitimacy of basic institutions—are homegrown. They bear a label that reads “Made in the USA.”

America’s Defining Problem in 2021 Isn’t China: It’s America

Worth a read. Seems as though another re-alignment is in the wind.

Last edited by chunkstyle; 01/06/21 06:22 PM.
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Oh yeah...

And both factions are committed to crushing the left...

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