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Greger Offline OP
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Manchin isn't much of one to change his mind.

He's a traditionalist.

How does DC statehood poll nationwide? How does it poll in West Virginia?

You know how folks are once their minds are made up.


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Manchin is my type of democrat as I'm also more or less a traditionalist. Biden was also once a traditionalist and was elected as a traditionalist Democratic Moderate.

Now on to D.C. The Constitution does mandate a federal district, but only limits its size at 10 square miles. Nothing in the constitution prevents it from being made smaller. In fact the southern portion of D.C. the portion south of the Potomac was returned to the state of Virginia. There’s nothing that would prevent the northern portion, the portion north of the Potomac back to Maryland as there is precedence for this type of move. Although a small portion of D.C. would have to remain a federal district. That could be only a few block area including the White House, the Capital, the SCOTUS building and a few others. No residences, but more or less a small business district.

Returning most of the northern, north of the Potomac portion back to Maryland would give Maryland an extra representative and enable the who reside, live in D.C. would be able to vote for Maryland’s two senators, a voting representative in the house along with giving them state legislatures and senators. This solution has the advantage that has been done before, precedence. Making a city a state hasn’t any precedence. A city, district mandated by the Constitution. Now there is the 23rd Amendment that would probably have to be addressed. D.C. isn’t a territory, it a Constitutional mandated district.

As for polls 55% against D.C. statehood, 29% in favor and 16% don’t give a cat’s meow.

https://www.washingtonian.com/2021/...-statehood-latest-poll-says-not-so-much/

Personally, I’m against D.C. statehood, but am in favor of returning the northern portion back to Maryland except for a small few block area which would remain the federal district. This solution would take politics out of it and give those living, residing in D.C. a vote in all functions of government both state and federally. It also has the advantage of precedence since returning a portion back to the state from whence it came was done before. Although there is the 23rd Amendment that would either have to be addressed or ignored.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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I'm afraid I'm going to have to agree with you on this.

Being a socialist progressive doesn't prevent me from also being a traditionalist.

DC statehood is a sort of power grabby Democrat thing. Like adding the justices of their choice to counterbalance the conservative supreme court.
They'd add a two dependable democratic senate seats.

I like the idea of adding northern DC to Maryland, it solves the problems without a lot of complications.


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Manchin is not my type of Democrat.

But I'm okay with him. He caucuses with the democrats but represents a red state. We could actually use more like him.

I'm not much of an advocate for sudden jerky change, Biden is veering left, Manchin is keeping him from going too far too fast. This dynamic, coupled with republican infighting over Trump are some of the things that are going to make 2022 an interesting race.


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As of now, independents are sticking with Biden, they like him. At least that is what the favorable and approval rating polls show. If I could have my way, Manchin would take Schumer's place and Romney McConnell's place. then perhaps we could get back to a long ago, at least it seems so, long ago political era of compromise and give and take with neither party threatening the nuclear option or adding SCOTUS or making D.C. a state.

I think my suggestion solves the problem if giving those folks who live in D.C. a voice and a vote in all government is the main problem. But I think the democrats don't care that much about giving the folks who reside and live in D.C. a voice and a vote, they want the additional 2 senators. Besides, my solution has precedence as it has been done before with the south of the Potomac portion being given back to the state of Virginia.

I think 2022 can easily belong to the Democrats if Biden and the democratic congress don't do something stupid to make independents angry at them. I think Biden has been pushing the envelope, but hasn't stepped over the line. Trump is an advantage to democrats, McConnell by his refusal to cooperate, at least some of the time and on some issues with Biden could also help. Remember Harry S. Truman used the do nothing congress for his big comeback win in 1948.

I think a majority of independents want cooperation whenever possible. Not obstruction of everything Biden. It's okay for McConnell and the GOP to fight Biden and congressional company 50% or even 60% or 70% of the time, but not 100%.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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Everybody would love to see some compromise.

One party has expressed some interest in it...the other has announced 100% obstruction.

Democrats will be waiting a long time for Republicans to come to the bargaining table. McConnell does NOT back down.


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Depends on what The Trump Party does with their Republicans: Dumping Liz Cheney and censuring Mitt Romney could lead to an independent Real Republican caucus in both House and Senate that might be willing to vote for good stuff the Democrats like too. If the leaders of the Trump Party crap on them I doubt they will be willing to go along with total obstruction. And now that the Democrats hold the edge, they can bring bills to a vote eventually.


We're flying electric helicopters on Mars yet you can't turn on your clothes dryer in Texas. That's because scientists are in charge of Mars, and Republicans are in charge of Texas.
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I think Cheney will be ousted any day now from her number three position and then be primaried out come the 2022 GOP Wyoming primary. If I was Liz, I'd run was an independent which has the potential to split the GOP vote and let the democrat win. This may also apply to the 9 other house members.

History, in 2010 the Tea Party in Alaska ran Joe Miller who beat Murkowski in the Republican Primary making Miller the GOP nominee for senate in that state. Murkowski ran as an independent write in candidate and beat both Miller and the democrat in the General election. As an write in candidate which makes her accomplishment all the more impressive. Cheney is no Murkowski and Wyoming isn't Alaska, Liz would probably have to gather enough signatures to get on the ballot. I doubt she'd would be able to accomplishing anything as a write in.

Having worked for Perot, running as an independent is very rough. Republicans and Democrats get automatic ballot access, all others, third parties, independents must jump through hoops gathering signatures which differ state by state. 50 different requirements and 50 different time limits. Then both Republicans and Democrats go over the signatures with a fine tuned comb trying to throw out as many as possible to avoid letting an independent or third party candidate gain ballot access. You need to gather at least twice as many signatures as any state law requires, sometimes three times.

Perot also had to file many law suites and spend millions just to get on the ballot in all 50 states. There's much more, but the two major parties don't like anyone challenging them.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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Beginning with the caveat that I cannot stand Liz Cheney, I don't think she's in as much trouble in Wyoming as she is in DC. Not, of course, that she's popular right now. But here's the thing: she is well known. ANYone who runs against her will not have name recognition like she has. She'll be able to tout her roots and her constant support for "Wyoming values" - at least in the rural parts. Also, it is likely that a number of wannabes will jump into the primary. I think she'll pull 20+%, which will likely swamp the other 9 wannabes. The farther from the impeachment, the better her chances. Plus, she may get a boost from the indictments that are coming before the end of the year. Again, I can't stand her, but her "conservative" bona fides are unassailable. She's just this side of fascist, but she is on the right side of that.

Last edited by NW Ponderer; 05/07/21 05:40 PM.

A well reasoned argument is like a diamond: impervious to corruption and crystal clear - and infinitely rarer.

Here, as elsewhere, people are outraged at what feels like a rigged game -- an economy that won't respond, a democracy that won't listen, and a financial sector that holds all the cards. - Robert Reich
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Liz Cheney voted with Trump 93% of the time - but she won't go with the loonies and say that Trump "won" the 2020 election. Seriously, how can ANYONE believe that the most hated, the most inept and incompetent, the biggest lying POTUS could ever be re-elected. That is some serious delusional thinking.


Contrarian, extraordinaire


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