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I debated on putting this under the “Did I hear that right” topic, but decided it deserved its own.

The prompt was this interview on the QAnon mental illness. It involves religion in a big way, but is bigger than that.

One comment - I find most religion to be just as delusional as the QAnon spectacle, but for the longer lasting ones there are wide swings between malevolence and benevolence in their histories. I noted that the CNN guys gave a tip of the hat to mainstream religion as not being kooky, which I see as an ingrained fear of doing something that might piss off the “sane” delusionals.

I’d score this gentleman as 100% BSC…

Donie: “What makes you think Tom Hanks is a child sacrificing pedophile?”

Angry Man: “How do you know he isn’t!!”


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I realize the question is unanswerable in any practical way, and that crazy falls on a spectrum. But it's a dramatic opener!

Going out on my own limb, I'll speculate that 80% of humanity is within that zone of the delusion spectrum as to cause themselves and others quantifiable damage.


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So forclarification, if you’re pretty much out of touch with reality but you’re NOT in danger of hurting yourself or others - does that mean you’re probably NOT batshit crazy?

…asking for a friend.


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Sounds reasonable...

Given that the subject is so vague and without definition, I suppose any definition is competitive!

(Note: it is probably a cosmic law that no one is competent to self-assess batsh!t craziness.)

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The number that keeps popping up is 30%


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Originally Posted by Greger
The number that keeps popping up is 30%
Would that be the population segment with the primary characteristic of Trump Cultist?


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This may be a side effect of Covid. It is known to cause neurological symptoms. Just shows how serious it is, that it can cause those in people who have never been infected or vaccinated! ( wink )

Seriously though, we probably need to test anti-vaxxers for SARS-COV2 antibodies. If most of them were infected with asymptomatic cases, the need to vaccinate them disappears and their "movement" is just a Long Covid symptom. ( idea )


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Actually, I had a more basic question: if x percent of the population is indeed batshit crazy, has that number changed over time, and if so, why? Clearly there were a large number of BCs during, say, the Cold Wa4 and the McCarthy era. The entire First World War was indicative of widespread batshit craziness. So were the careers of Jim and Tammy Faye Baker, though on a much smaller scale.

So - has the percentage changed over time?


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Originally Posted by Mellowicious
So - has the percentage changed over time?
According to my source (me) - not really. There are ups and downs but the average is safely above 80%. Might even be 100%, rounding to the nearest whole number. Some people are saying (me), everyone is "on the spectrum".


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Damn. That’s a lot. So what you’re saying is, my “certifiable” certificate probably isn’t worth all that much on the open market?


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I think it's a pretty steady 30%. But they can often convince another 20% to go along with their cockeyed schemes.

I guess to me, batshit craziness is a political disorder. An ideological disease.

Just as we are born man or woman...we are born liberal or conservative.

Conservatism being a genetic flaw and batshit craziness being the rarer, more chronic form.


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I submit that Conservatism is a mental disorder. Prove me wrong. smile


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Originally Posted by Greger
I guess to me, batshit craziness is a political disorder. An ideological disease.
I learned from the CNN interview linked in the OP that “cheese pizza” is code for “child pornography”. That is clear evidence that there is a kiddiesex room in the basement of pizzarias and anyone who orders cheese pizza can meet HRC and that Hanks guy there. I bet they even serve “red beer” by the pitcher, with the “tomato juice” coming from a “baby tap”. Bottoms up!

Interestingly, the woman who revealed that fact was regarded to be apolitical, a strong Christian believer who cares deeply about children. Ergo, the bounds of batsh!tcraziness do not stop at politics. Any belief risks falling into the bsc well if its basis be murky and adherence devout.


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Originally Posted by pdx rick
I submit that Conservatism is a mental disorder. Prove me wrong. smile

I'm pretty sure it's genetic due to the apparent 50/50 split in the population.

To a liberal, it certainly looks like a mental illness, but be aware that from the conservative standpoint it is the liberals who are mentally unbalanced or BSC.

Remember the half-black half-white episode of Star Trek? It's like that but the difference between the two is invisible and doesn't present itself until ideology surfaces during conversations.

You know when it happens because you can feel the small hairs down your spine rising...

Along with your blood pressure.

You've had a close encounter with someone who is batshit crazy.


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30%

Three outa ten.

Thirty in every hundred.

Are f*cking batshit crazy.

We're at an odd intersection in time where the Venn diagram of all truly batshit crazy people in the USA and The Republican Party have melded into a single circle.


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I tend to agree with Greger, to those on opposite sides of the political spectrum, the other side does seem batshit crazy. That in today’s modern political era of polarization, the great divide and the super, mega, ultra-high partisanship, it has become more overt. More open for one and all to see.

There was a time if one is old enough to remember. That these ideological battles took place within each party, behind closed doors. Each party had their conservative and liberal wings. The Democrats, the solid conservative south. The Republicans, the Rockefeller liberal Republicans of the northeast. Back in those days, the northeast was pretty much solid Republican. With each party getting rid of their unwanted wings, that brought the debate out into the open, more of a party vs. party thing than and internal debate within each party.

Bringing this into more focus is the fact the Democratic Party has shrunk quite a lot while independents, the more middle of the roaders have grown. You can see this in this link which goes only to 2014.

Interesting in 1961 51% of the electorate identified themselves as Democrats, 28% Republicans, 20% independents. Reagan was a game changer. Democrats dropped from 45 down to 35% during his presidency. Republicans rose from 23% up to 30% while independents became 30% of the electorate. By 2014, Democrats down to 32%, republican down to 23% and independents at 39%.

https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/interactives/party-id-trend/

Today or as 17 Aug 2021, Gallup puts party affiliation at Democratic 29%, Republican 26%, independent 40%. What’s interesting to me is that since Eisenhower, the GOP has averaged around 26% of the electorate with a few ups and downs. It’s the Democratic Party that has really shrunk, independents grown. As to why, I suppose everyone can come up with their own reasons. I’m sure part of it has been the shedding of each party’s unwanted wing and perhaps each party now trying to get rid of its moderates. Each party having their own litmus tests. As a result, what had been intraparty disputes usually kept behind closed doors have boiled over in the mass political arena for one and all to see. Conservative Republican vs. Liberal Democrat. Hence the rapid growth of independents. Looking at the numbers, I would say those who left the Democratic Party didn’t go over to the GOP, they became independents. Not beholding to either party. Although some did switch parties, most went into the non-affiliated column. My two cents.


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Originally Posted by perotista
As to why, I suppose everyone can come up with their own reasons.
Turbocharged negative opposition branding, most of it dishonest, coupled with unleashed and unhinged media access.

Baiting the batshit crazy gullible.


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I am coming to this one late. My thought on the crazies is that, I think, this is the first time that a significant group of voters have gathered under a system of belief that has little to do with verifiable truth. Instead we have the opposite. If one side claims the sky is blue then the other side will claim the opposite, even if the sky is, obviously, blue!

This one blows me away and makes no sense and is, in the case of covid, actually killing the supposed crazies. Its really pretty amazing and vaccines are a really good example of taking obvious truth and actually dying to prove that vaccines are bad and, then, ignoring the fact that their belief just killed a fellow traveler. It gets even worse because this is not happening for a single true-believer but a LOT of true-believers yet they continue to fight the truth! Seems to me that when thousands of the true believers start dying somebody might get a message? I guess not...........

Somehow I am no longer sure the term "crazy" is appropriate. Battles and wars have been fought over religious beliefs and that's a known fact. However, that being said, those battles were not being fought over obvious, verifiable truths but beliefs based on what is, basically, non-provable as far as obvious and verifiable are concerned.

Again, I suspect, that "insane" might be better.

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Interesting in 1961 51% of the electorate identified themselves as Democrats, 28% Republicans, 20% independents. Reagan was a game changer. Democrats dropped from 45 down to 35% during his presidency.
Racist Democrats had a welcoming open arms invitation to join Republicans after Reagan's Neshoba County Fair "states' rights" speech lamenting black "Welfare Queens driving Cadillacs."

No surprise in those statistics perotista. smile


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In my opinion, Independents are like bisexuals, who prefer their own kind, but hide behind a label suggesting open mindedness.

White the independent label suggests open mindedness, I submit that in really, independents will vote mostly Dem or Republican as they had done previously before becoming "independent" - and again, I submit that they simply are too cowardly to admit to their party's affiliation. Hmm

Both bisexuals and Independents relish is their perceived ambiguity, but in reality, there is none. They simply don't want the stigma of their own kinds' label. They can then say, they're not like the others of their own kind THAT is the real reason for their ambiguity. Hmm

Yes, sometimes the bisexual and independent stray off the reservation - but those times are rare and should be considered one-offs. laugh


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All of this may or may not be true. Interesting though. I think the change for whatever reason from Democratic to independent since the GOP has basically stayed within a few points of where they were in 1960. Is control of congress. Democrats controlled the house for 40 straight years from 1955-1994 and for 58 out of 62 going back to 1933.

It took the very popular Eisenhower to finally wrestle control of the House from the Democrats. Of course, everyone liked IKE. But that lasted but 2 years and then back to normal Democratic control. I was born right after WWII and never dreamed the Republicans would ever control the house.

But since then, 1994, the house has switch several times, 1994, 2006, 2010, 2018 and by large numbers. 54,33, 63 and 44 seats. Perhaps the power of the independent vote today whereas prior to 1994, they didn't make up that large part of the electorate along with a much larger Democratic base vote.

Perhaps besides racism as you all put it, is the religious aspect that Reagan embraced. Protestants voted Republican since 1972, the farthest back my figures take me, sometimes by large amount, sometimes by a small amount. But Catholics voted Democratic until 2000 when they switch to Republican and have voted that way ever since. Jewish has always been Democratic.

Lots have changed demographically, HS and less educationally wise was solid Democratic until Trump 1972-2012. College grads voted Republican until 2008 and then again for Romney in 2012 before going for Clinton and Biden. Blacks have remain constant Democratic usually with 90% of the vote along with Hispanics, low of 53% for Kerry 2004, a high of 69% for Bill Clinton in 1996. Whites have been solid Republican at least since 1972, Not counting 1992 and 1996 when Perot received 20% and 9%, the GOP candidate received 55-60%.

Somethings remain the same, others change.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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Originally Posted by perotista
...Perhaps besides racism as you all put it, is the religious aspect that Reagan embraced. Protestants voted Republican since 1972, the farthest back my figures take me, sometimes by large amount, sometimes by a small amount. But Catholics voted Democratic until 2000 when they switch to Republican and have voted that way ever since. Jewish has always been Democratic...
...from another thread:

Quote
Several years ago, 60 Minutes did a segment on morality, titled, Born good?, in which studies have found that toddlers exhibit morality. It is thought that morality is innate and we are actually "born that way."

If true, then the whole purpose for religion is for naught.


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I don't think that groups of people have switched Parties so much as both Parties have very consciously sought out and changed positions in order to attract groups of people. The best example of this is LBJ and the Civil Rights Act. He was pretty damned racist, and he made the decision to lose Southern Conservatives, in favor of people of color. I think it was simple math, not some higher ethics!

Trump embraced that choice and went full KKK.


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Originally Posted by pondering_it_all
I don't think that groups of people have switched Parties so much as both Parties have very consciously sought out and changed positions in order to attract groups of people. The best example of this is LBJ and the Civil Rights Act. He was pretty damned racist, and he made the decision to lose Southern Conservatives, in favor of people of color. I think it was simple math, not some higher ethics!

Trump embraced that choice and went full KKK.

...went full KKK / flat Earther. smile


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Originally Posted by pondering_it_all
I don't think that groups of people have switched Parties so much as both Parties have very consciously sought out and changed positions in order to attract groups of people. The best example of this is LBJ and the Civil Rights Act. He was pretty damned racist, and he made the decision to lose Southern Conservatives, in favor of people of color. I think it was simple math, not some higher ethics!

Trump embraced that choice and went full KKK.
Interesting, I hadn't thought of it that way. I know from the civil war until the great depression, the Republican Party was the majority party, Democratic Party the smaller one. The Great Depression, FDR and then WWII reversed that. Big time in some years. The Democrats had majorities in the House like 333-89 in 1937-38 and 75-17 in the senate. FDR swamping all 4 of his Republican opponents. The GOP carrying just a couple of meaningless states in the Northeast against FDR.

The south remained Democratic until Reagan in 1980 even with LBJ's Civil Rights Act. The northeast mainly Republican until Bill Clinton. Here's some maps.

https://www.270towin.com/historical-presidential-elections/

But yes, it does seems the parties switch to going after people, groups instead of people switching parties. LBJ may have been the last Democratic presidential candidate to win the white vote. He did in 1964 59-41 over Goldwater. The problem is demographics were lost in 1968 and didn't pick up again until 1972. Carter in 1976 came close to winning the white vote, losing it to Ford 47-52. No Democratic presidential candidate has come close to Carter's 47% since 1976.

Then again, no Republican presidential candidate has come close to Ford's 16% of the black vote in 1976. Trump's 12% last year was the closest along with Reagan who received 12% in 1988 in his 49-1 state wallop of Mondale.

Simple Math makes sense to me.


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I believe your polls are irrelevant to meaningless without state demographics.

As an example, Republicans in Texas fear demographic dynamics will castrate their stranglehold on power. They have therefore used the delusion of fraudulent voting to enact a voting law which will make voting for selected groups of predominantly Democrat voters more difficult to actually vote. The theory is in razor close elections, just disenfranchising mere thousands of potential "enemy" voters could mean the difference in remaining in power. As it becomes more difficult to remain in power expect even more onerous laws to be enacted.

Would the word fascist adequately describe laws enacted by Texas Republicans????


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I don't see Texas being much different from anywhere else, especially Florida.

Fascist is a funny word. No one really knows what it means. A bundle of rods is stronger than a single rod. The fascia tries the rods together just as the fascist government ties the people together. Whether they want to be tied together or not...

Yes, Mr. Porter, Republicans of all stripes everywhere are fascist in a sense, but not everyone knows or understands the early 19th-century Italian politics that led to it, nor the fate of Mussolini who made it famous.

Republicans have not yet garnered the kind of power it takes to establish a genuine fascist dictator. Once a nation heads that direction its fate is pretty much sealed.

Quote
Would the word fascist adequately describe laws enacted by Texas Republicans????


For clarity's sake, I think "authoritarian" is the best word to use at this time. Though I won't argue that they're definitely leaning in a fascist direction.

Things appear pretty bleak right now but it's just the last gasps of a dying generation trying to reclaim the glory years.

Eat right, stay healthy and try to live long enough to see the republican party step on leggos, eat sh*t, and die...

That's my plan.


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...went full KKK / flat Earther.

Went full enabler for the batshit crazy 30%

In the end their votes won't be worth the trouble they cause.


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Here's a splendid example:

Lindsey Graham was making a speech where he advocated getting vaccinated. His crowd didn't like that. One man with a loud voice declared that he was losing his civil service job in 60 days. Graham asked if he was anti-vaccine and Loud Boy said he wasn't, but he was anti-mandate.

I tried doing the math, on the presumption that Loud Boy wasn't batsh!t crazy, but was unable to find a formula that worked. I couldn't get past the arithmetic that if Loud Boy had acted on the fact that he wasn't anti-vaccine, and had gotten one before there was a mandate, then the mandate wouldn't have been a factor in his equation at all.

Using human calculus, solving for the function of x as batsh!t approaches crazy, the derivative is that Loud Boy is insane.


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The Supreme Court decided long ago that total mandates are constitutional. These are not even real mandates: They just say you can't work here if you are not vaccinated. You are perfectly free to go do something else. Since being unvaccinated does actually present danger to the immune-compromised, the elderly, and such, there is a rational basis for these job requirements. Certain jobs have job requirements. That's all these are.

The armed forces have been very strict about vaccine mandates for a very long time. They don't even ask! They just tell you to stand in this line and get a bunch of shots.


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Originally Posted by pondering_it_all
The Supreme Court decided long ago that total mandates are constitutional.
"You can't tell me what to do, especially if I want to do it!!!"


You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.
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You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.
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Special for Je Furry...



You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
To change something, build a new model that makes the old model obsolete.
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Which is more striking: the gullibility of the flock; or the willingness to deceive by the shepherd?



You never change things by fighting the existing reality.
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I was just reclining on the couch, Morty the crazy-haired little dog wedged in at my side, eyes closed and thinking about a dream I was having before getting up to make coffee. It was an interesting but seemingly meaningless series of events that had a woman flying through the air hanging from a rope which wasn’t attached to anything but the sky. On the ground, a bunch of big hoses were being used to drain a large and deep pond that had accumulated a lot of water from some event. As I drifted into remembering it I was having trouble with some details and experienced sort of a repeated loop of a ten second bit, then began to wonder if that bit was actually in the dream, or if it was new dreaming. As I woke up from that I realized that I was dreaming that I was dreaming new stuff while dreaming I was recollecting a dream.

I wonder how I can ever know what’s in the minds of others when I know this kind of wacky sh!t is going on in my own?


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Well that simply confirms that you are batchit Loggy. I am glad I am not………

I am the epitome of total rationality and a logical thinking. But I also do believe the conversion of that drunken hobo into an operatic singer was the mysterious works of God. He does indeed work in mysterious ways, or so it has been said.

Simply witness the disciples of Trump.


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Confirmation! At long last...

Would you say that Trump's disciples are disciplined in a rational and logical way?


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All of the above.


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I should have inserted the appropriate ironic emoticon. But I never know what the appropriate one might be. To me that is the difficulty and the difference twixt text versus face-to-face communications.


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I wonder if the original Bible included emojis to ensure clarity in communicating Gawd's Word? Hmm


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https://www.theverge.com/2016/1/17/10777102/upside-down-smile-emoji-sarcasm-ambiguity

The upside-down face emoji is headed for trouble. Approved as part of Unicode 8.0, it rolled out to iOS 9.1 and Android Marshmallow earlier this year, and in the past three months, the meaning has become remarkably consistent. Dropped at the end of a sentence, the face typically suggests the previous statement should be taken in jest, like so:

Last edited by TatumAH; 10/15/21 03:39 AM. Reason: confusion

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Homo sapiens... the only species intelligent enough to extirpate itself. (But at least we have emojis!)

tonbricks


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if someone had to ask, then the percent is too high


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I think the percentage has always been the same. It's a survival thing...sometimes you need them as cannon fodder.


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And sometimes you need them in complete control of the country?


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It appears to be a cyclic thing. On occasion they are right.


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Quote
On occasion they are right
You mean of course, broken clocks are right twice a day. That does not imply people who are batsheis crazy are ever right. Their crazy is of the invariant kind ... always crazy.


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There was a time when you were considered BSC if you thought a Black man was equal to a white. But yes, a little like a clock being right twice a day or a blind hog finding the occasional acorn.


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Harry Anslinger, the head of the federal Narcotics Police, got marijuana made illegal with his argument that weed made Black men think they were as good as a White man. OMG! We can't have that!


We're flying electric helicopters on Mars yet you can't turn on your clothes dryer in Texas. That's because scientists are in charge of Mars, and Republicans are in charge of Texas.
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Originally Posted by pondering_it_all
Harry Anslinger, the head of the federal Narcotics Police, got marijuana made illegal with his argument that weed made Black men think they were as good as a White man. OMG! We can't have that!
...or MDMA being banned in July 1985 because of Ronald Regan. rolleyes


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America's drug policy is basically that anything fun must be made illegal. The government fun-squashers run into problems when a new research chemical just happens to be something our bodies make naturally! Hard to criminalize that...

And that's a real possibility: Drugs wouldn't work if we didn't have receptors that fit them.


We're flying electric helicopters on Mars yet you can't turn on your clothes dryer in Texas. That's because scientists are in charge of Mars, and Republicans are in charge of Texas.
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This tickled my funny bone to the point of my wife asking, “What the hell are you laughing at now?” That made me wonder if Robo Rabbi would find a reason to laugh, too? Or at least chuckle a little bit?


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Artificial Intelligence like Robo Rabbi takes all the fun and surprise out of human religion.Robo Rabi would never be caught dead like this! How do you spell BSC in Biblical red letter lingo?

Last edited by TatumAH; 10/22/21 01:30 AM.

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Originally Posted by TatumAH
Artificial Intelligence like Robo Rabbi takes all the fun and surprise out of human religion.Robo Rabi would never be caught dead like this! How do you spell BSC in Biblical red letter lingo?
Rightwingers and their fetishes. rolleyes


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If I’ve said it once… autos will be the death of us.


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Originally Posted by logtroll
If I’ve said it once… autos will be the death of us.
Just goes to show that you can have TOO MUCH FUN! Know when to NOT say MOAR! grin


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Originally Posted by logtroll
If I’ve said it once… autos will be the death of us.

That's what David Carradine and Michael Hutchence said... coffee

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Originally Posted by TatumAH
Originally Posted by logtroll
If I’ve said it once… autos will be the death of us.
Just goes to show that you can have TOO MUCH FUN! Know when to NOT say MOAR! grin


Hmm

auto is like solitaire, it's a game for one. laugh


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What percentage of humanity is bath!t crazy? Di'ja see the Republicans grilling Merrick Garland today?!?

Answer: All of them Katie

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Former sheriff and Trump Supporter David Clark was recently heard to say that the only problem he had with Jan 6 was that it wasn't well organized.

At a speaking event in Idaho an attendee asked the speaker "when do we get to use the guns" against Democrats.

Frankly, I wish more of them would. I have no love for Democrats so if a few here and there were gunned down it might do more to illustrate the violent and dangerous turn Republicans have taken.


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Idaho Shooter visited Governor's office while open carrying sidearm

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Boise Mall shooting

BOISE (Idaho Statesman) — The man identified by police as the perpetrator of Monday’s fatal shooting at the Boise Towne Square mall was a felon who had been flagged by Idaho State Police in April on suspicion of illegally possessing firearms, according to public records.

Jacob Bergquist, 27, had a run-in with Idaho State Police at the Statehouse on April 2 that prompted the agency to investigate potential charges against him, a police report shows. The Boise Police Department on Tuesday identified Bergquist as the man who killed two people and injured several others in a Monday afternoon shooting at the mall, firing 18 rounds inside the building.

According to the Idaho State Police report, Trooper James Love saw Bergquist apparently recording a video in the Capitol rotunda at around 2 p.m. April 2. When the trooper directed another Capitol visitor toward Gov. Brad Little’s office, Bergquist followed, Love said.

Love said in the report that he had noticed Bergquist was “armed with a holstered semiautomatic handgun on his left hip.” It is legal to carry firearms at the Idaho State Capitol.

Love said he followed Bergquist and the other visitor to the governor’s office, where Bergquist asked the trooper whether he could speak to the governor. Love directed Bergquist to the receptionist, Tamara Felter.

“I listened while the young man explained to Ms. Felter that he wanted to interview the governor to get his thoughts on persons convicted of felonies being able to carry guns,” Love wrote. “He went on to say that he was a felon and that by Idaho Code 18-310 he was able to carry a firearm and that he was trying to get the word out to others that they, too, could carry in Idaho.”

The Idaho code Bergquist cited outlines how the right to possession of a firearm is restored to individuals convicted of certain Idaho felonies when their sentences are served. Public records show that Bergquist was arrested in Cook County, Illinois, in 2012 and convicted of theft in excess of $300. That charge is a Class 3 felony in Illinois. The Idaho Statesman has reached out to Cook County authorities for more details on the conviction.

Bergquist told Felter that he was convicted of theft, according to Love’s police report. He also reiterated to Love that Idaho Code 18-310 allowed him to possess firearms in Idaho.

Love requested that the Ada County Prosecutor’s Office investigate charges against Bergquist for violation of Idaho Code 18-310 as well as Code 18-3316, which makes it a felony for a convicted felon to possess firearms.

According to an emailed statement from the Ada County Prosecutor’s Office, it followed up on Love’s request.

“Our office determined he was not a prohibited possessor in Idaho, based on Idaho’s laws including Idaho Code Section 18-3316 and 18-310,” the statement said. “Idaho Code Section 18-310(2) has a list of qualifying felony convictions which prohibit firearm possession. Mr. Bergquist did not have a felony conviction for a listed offense. He was prosecuted for a qualifying offense in another state, but that case did not result in a qualifying felony conviction. On July 28, 2011, a misdemeanor judgment of conviction was entered in that case. He was prosecuted for a retail theft offense in Illinois which does not qualify under 18-310 as a qualifying felony prior conviction. Our office could not take any action.”

Too bad nobody was warned in Idaho! Live free AND die!
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