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Originally Posted by perotista
I would suggest the democrats in order to win the next election need to come up with a way to combat inflation and rising prices.l
Dems can combat the global supply chain issues? Do you also think the POTUS controls gas prices? Hmm


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Some people are saying that Manchin has been going around for the past several months telling his colleagues that he thought the Child Tax Credit was bad because poor people might just take that money and spend it on drugs.

I assume Manchin means street drugs, and not talking about the $650 Epipens that Joe's daughter made millions from.

"They'll just spend it on drugs" is a common refrain we hear from Rightwingers over and over again and the reason why we can't have nice things and people have to live in poverty.

This above is a common belief for people who neither want to pay higher taxes nor feel bad about hoarding vast amounts of wealth while other people are barely scraping by.

mad


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Maserati / Houseboat Joe is exactly what he sounds like: A rich old man who's generally out of touch with the needs of actual poor people and who constantly talks to lobbyists who reinforce his prejudices about them.


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Presidents always take credit for a good economy, when it goes bad, presidents get the blame. Perhaps if presidents stopped taking credit when things are going good, they wouldn't get blamed when things turn sour.

It's always been this way. The economy is like the weather, its going to do what its going to do. If presidents take the credit, they'll get the blame. I don't hold Biden responsible, but independents do. Now did you make the same excuse for Bush II with his receission? Probably not.

If a president, government in general could control the economy, we'd have nothing but ups and good times. Perhaps the blame for Biden getting blamed goes back to all those previous presidents who took credit for a good economy.

It is what it is. Unless presidents stop taking credit, they're going to get the blame.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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Presidents really don't take credit for anything. Presidents are simply painted with whatever is going on. Its nice to think they can "take" credit but that's just not how it works. My own thought is that Biden, for instance, thinks he can take credit but, because he is president, is gifted with blame, credit, whatever and he/she (sometime) will has absolutely NOTHING to do with it! I think this is really important and everybody should understand that. I have watched presidents try and claim all sorts of things but, when it has to do with thing financial, etc. they president is the goat - good or bad. Hell, they get blamed for the Weather!

A president also needs to sell, all the time. It helps with stuff in the first paragraph. They also have to be seen doing things, not claiming things - DOING THINGS! Biden has not been doing either as far as I can tell. The man really needs to stand up and be counted insofar as his job goes. He needs to be "The Teacher of the Nation". He is great at hugging children, understanding things bad, etc. but he doesn't explain stuff very well. As far as I can tell, from whtat some in gov have said, he also has a tendency to ignore a lot that he shouldn't. Its like the BBB bill, between the Dems and Biden that simply hasn't a chance in hell. They reference this and that but have never, as far as I know, actually, explained what the hell they are doing! its even better than that! They keep changing stuffr! I believe, for instance, that Manchin, is pissed off because them clever progressives keep sneaking and messing with it. Last night I also noticed those clever progressives ranking bigtime on Manchin and want him gone. That, I think, pretty much describes the progressives. If they get rid of Manchin that destroys any chance they have and they are no longer have any power in the Senate but that won't bother the Progressives as they, obviously, know best! They sure as hell have no real interest of winning anything. They would rather just mess with stuff and whine A LOT!

I should add that I am actually for most of which is in the BBB legislation. I just think things should be dealt with one by one instead of trying to do everything at one time. I think that because that way its more likely something will actually get done. Something, obviously, the Progressives just don't get it. I think it might be interesting to see how the progressives would deal with just one of their acts of wishful thinking.

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I agree with almost all what you said. It makes sense and it makes political sense. Here’s an article today on Manchin

“Rumors swirl that Manchin could defect from the Democratic Party after he sank Biden's Build Back Better spending plan”

https://news.yahoo.com/rumors-swirl-manchin-could-defect-130857682.html

Yes, It does seem to me the progressives want Manchin gone. If I were treated like Manchin has been by the party I belonged to, I’d have been long gone. I’d have said to Hades with you. If Manchin were to make this move, to become an independent, the question arises who he would vote for to be the next senate majority leader? Schumer or McConnell? Or would Manchin abstain?

I do think sooner or later the progressives will get their wish, they have piled tons of abuse on Manchin, they want him gone, he just might oblige them sooner than later. That would kill any of the progressive wing of the Democratic Party agenda until at least after the midterms.Probably until 2025 as it seems the GOP will take back the house next year anyway.

For progressives, a word of advice, be careful what you wish for, you might get it.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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I would expect him to go independent but that won't turn down the progressives yelling at him as he is their favorite goat. It is, I think, shameful that the Dem progressives feel its necessary to rank on somebody who has consistently voted for them except for their whiz bang super legislation which change constantly, is sold by nobody, and which nobody really knows what's even in it. (at least I have never heard or seen anybody that claims that). All anybody knows are the general thoughts but no specifics. What we all do know is that it holds all the dreams of all the progressives who seem to pick little things, in that one, to support. Its not quite as bad as a month ago but, still...........

Oh, Manchin, on the other hand, has yet to go after the progressives in the same personal, and offensive, mode that they use. The other thing that bothers me is that they have picked on Manchin (the man) and not Sinema (the woman) who is, I think, a bit more flighty than Manchin due to the fact that she actually seems to be controlled by her big supporters and she dances a lot.

I also, incidentally, believe there are more Dems on Manchin's side than is public.

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I noticed that, it’s all Manchin these days and not Sinema. Since Manchin is from probably the reddest state in the nation, I can understand his intransigent. Sinema on the other hand is from a purple state turning blue. I don’t think you have to worry about Manchin becoming a Republican. Not as long as Trump is in charge of that party. Manchin has been quoted many times that Trump disgusts him. But becoming an independent is a very real possibility. I wouldn’t blame him. He also said he’d continue to caucus with the Democrats. But would they let him or drive him further away from them into McConnell waiting arms?

I still think this boiled down to the numbers. A 50-50 split in the senate doesn’t have the numbers for any major legislation. There’s usually a couple or more senators that disagree. If the senate was 55-45, Manchin wouldn’t be a problem. Schumer would gladly let him vote no if it meant keeping his seat in Democratic hands. Back in 2010, Pelosi let 34 Democratic house members vote nay on the ACA hoping their Nay vote would keep them as democrats in the house. She had the numbers where 34 defections didn’t hinder the ACA from passing. The numbers aren’t there today. Even doing away with the filibuster, as long as Manchin and probably Sinema oppose most of the progressive agenda, that’s no help. You would also have to have those two to vote Yea on eliminate the filibuster which Manchin has said he wouldn’t.

I’m with you in that beginning next year the Democrats should regroup. Take all of what’s included in the BBB and break it down into separate bills. Then go after it one bill at a time. If those items in the BBB are as popular as the Democrats say they are, then passing them one by one may be feasible.


It's high past time that we start electing Americans to congress and the presidency who put America first instead of their political party. For way too long we have been electing Republicans and Democrats who happen to be Americans instead of Americans who happen to be Republicans and Democrats.
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